Episode talk:Cautionary Tales

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Checklist for Cautionary Tales

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Episode article:

_X_ Episode screencap
_X_ Monologue
_X_ Summary
_X_ Story Development
_X_ Synopsis
_X_ Quotes

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_X_ Episode redirect: Cautionary Tales
_X_ Check that links from previous episode work
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___ New interviews and videos
_X_ Add Heroes Interactive:Cautionary Tales
_X_ ... and its redirect, Heroes Interactive (Cautionary Tales)
_X_ Episode commentaries
___ Update director, writer, etc. pages
_X_ Add Category:Images from Cautionary Tales
_X_ Update template:imagenav
_X_ Update template:image-screenshot
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n/a Peter
n/a Nathan
_X_ Claire
_X_ Matt
_X_ Hiro
n/a Niki
_X_ Mohinder
n/a Micah
_X_ Noah
n/a Sylar
_X_ Ando
n/a Maya
_X_ Adam
_X_ Elle
n/a Monica

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n/a Groups
_x_ Appearances
___ Connections

Update other character pages as needed

_X_ Update Portal:Minor Characters as appropriate
_X_ West
_X_ Kaito
_X_ Molly
_X_ Bob
_X_ Sandra
_X_ Lyle
_X_ Angela
_X_ Detective Fuller
_X_ Kimiko
_X_ Mr. Muggles

Add new character pages as needed:
_X_ old monk at Kaito's funeral
_X_ Coach Randolph
_X_ chanting monk (I) (at Kaito's funeral)
_X_ chanting monk (II) (at Kaito's funeral)
_X_ flashback monk (at Ishi's funeral))

___ Update Portal:Guest Cast as appropriate
_X_ Sekai Murashige (Young Hiro) (image)
_X_ Tak Kubota (old monk) (image)
_X_ Tami-Adrian George (Coach Randolph) (image)
_X_ Noriaki Ito (chanting monk (I)) ((image)
_X_ Kenjun Kawawata (chanting monk (II))
_X_ Rikio Nakashita (flashback monk)

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_X_ despoil spoiler images, update source, etc.

Add references to appropriate recurring themes:
_X_ Moral ambiguity
_X_ Death
___ Loyalty vs. treachery (Claire)
_X_ Family
_X_ Sacrifice

Add examples of Powers used:
Note: if an "examples" page exists, that's where examples should be added.
_X_ Examples of flight
_X_ Examples of lightning
_X_ Examples of rapid cell regeneration
_X_ Examples of telepathy / Telepathy
_X_ Examples of space-time manipulation

Get screencaps:

_X_ Episode title (650x365)
_X_ Episode lead image (300x169)

New characters (200x250):
_X_ Image:Coach randolph.jpg
_X_ Image:old monk.jpg
_X_ Image:chanting monk I.jpg
_X_ Image:chanting monk II.jpg
_X_ Image:flashback monk.jpg

New groups (450x350)
___ N/A

New Events/Items/Things/etc. (450x350)
_X_ Image:Kaitos funeral.jpg

New locations (450x350)
_X_ N/A

New places (450x350)
_X_ Image:aoyama cemetary.jpg
_X_ Image:Costa Verde beach.jpg
_X_ Image:Costa verde hotel.jpg

All powers used (450x350)
_X_ Image:Powers elle autoelectrocute.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers elle ball lightning.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers elle breaks a glass.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers elle burns through her bonds.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers elle fistful of lightning.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers elle flyin and fryin.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers hiro frozen ando.jpg
___ Hiro leaving the funeral _X_ Image:Powers hiro return to roof.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers hiro rooftop teleportation.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers matt commands angela.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers matt commands angela 2.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers matt commands fuller.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers matt commands fuller 2.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers matt eat your cereal.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers matt molly obeys.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers regeneration noah heals 1.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers regeneration noah heals.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers west claires message.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers west escapes with claire.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers west grabs bennet 2.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers west grabs bennet.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers west into the sunset.jpg
_X_ Image:Powers west snatches elle.jpg

All Symbol appearances (450x350)
_X_ Image:Symbol toy kensei sword.jpg

New paintings (full size)
_X_ Image:PaintingDeath.jpg (updated)

New prophecies/realizations (300x200)
_X_ Image:Painting realized hrg dead.jpg
_X_ Image:Painting realized mohinder fires gun.jpg

Whoo, boy!

Cesar Lemus just sent me the storyboards for the big confrontation scene from tonight's episode. I won't upload them until after the show airs, but I can promise it's going to be a pretty intense scene. It looks like there's going to be some cool special effects, and it's not one to miss. I'm psyched! -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 13:37, 19 November 2007 (EST)

  • I'm sitting here sweating bullets worrying about Noah, myself. D: --AnotherNella 20:18, 19 November 2007 (EST)

This episodes got my heart pounding.

I keep thinking someones gonna get shot. I was sitting there thinking Mohinder was gonna take one straight between the eyes! West's acting isn't the best (Mr. Butler, what are youuu doing?) but the whole episodes got me on the edge of my seat. Putting Elle in water is sick! 5 stars already!--Riddler 21:32, 19 November 2007 (EST)

  • Adam definitely spoke true when he said he would take all that Hiro loved...--Japanimation 21:44, 19 November 2007 (EST)
    • That wasn't that much of a shocker though. Bob did tell Nathan that it was Adam.--Riddler 21:46, 19 November 2007 (EST)
      • It was a shocker in that we now know that Hiro knows. - ZachsMind 17:14, 21 November 2007 (EST)
      • Great episode so far. Totally makes up for last weeks let downs.--Mish(Talk) 21:46, 19 November 2007 (EST)
        • That wasn't surprising. Goodbye, Noah.--Japanimation 21:54, 19 November 2007 (EST)
          • Trecord, I removed your post 'cause it's still a spoiler. That's not this episode. In any case, dammit Mohinder!--Riddler 21:54, 19 November 2007 (EST)
          • RESTORED: Well, I guess the urn really is Noah's. —TRECORD— Talk/Contrib 21:53, 19 November 2007 (EST) (Restored on the grounds that Noah was shot in this episode, and this episode did show the urn. Besides, talk pages should be used to discuss the merits of deleting something rather than unilaterally censoring something without any input. --TRECORD-- Talk/Contrib 22:19, 19 November 2007 (EST))
            • I think...I just sh** myself...NOEZ!!! NOT F***ING BENNET!!!!!!--DarkPhoenix 21:56, 19 November 2007 (EST)
              • This is officially the worst day of my life. ._.;;; Thrashmeister 21:56, 19 November 2007 (EST)
                • Oh snap. Never mind. :X 22:01, 19 November 2007 (EST)
                • What a twist!!!--Japanimation 22:00, 19 November 2007 (EST)
                  • New they didnt have the stones to kill Noah!--Mish(Talk) 22:01, 19 November 2007 (EST)
              • Ten minutes prior I was getting through telling my brother than I didn't think injecting the blood would work, as the bullet went through his head and I expected the brain to be dead, but I'm glad it turned out as it did. And I LOVE how they mirrored the first time Claire came back from the dead.--Riddler 22:02, 19 November 2007 (EST)
                    • That mirrored Claire in that one Season One episode...I loved it! "Holy-"--DarkPhoenix 22:03, 19 November 2007 (EST)
                      • Just wondering, did anybody else soil their pants besides me? I know DarkPhoenix did, but... Thrashmeister 22:05, 19 November 2007 (EST)
                        • It was kind of an expected thing for me so I wasn't surprised.--Japanimation 22:09, 19 November 2007 (EST)
  • Wait, wait, wait... in painting 8/8, Claire and West are so obviously kissing. Yet they're obviously not when the painting is realized. Also, I don't think Mr. Bennet was actually wearing a plaid jacket. Yeah. Thrashmeister 22:16, 19 November 2007 (EST)
    • When i first saw painting no.8 i thought it was Claire being held back, i never even considered that they were kissing, so i guess it wasn't so obvious...03:53, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • Eh. It looked like they were kissing to me. Anyway, you couldn't see Claire's mouth in the painting either way. Thrashmeister 07:53, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • So disappointed that West survives the electrical shock and fall. --Borowki 12:14, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • Well he did have to land on Claire, who took the force of it. And I just have to say, this was arguably the best episode I've seen of this series so far. From the emotion to the plot development, and it didn't even have Peter or the Haitian (my favorite character). Just an absolute success in this weak 2nd volume. Too bad Kring didn't go on strike earlier, it seems to have inspired him a bit in the end. --PsymonM77 3:19, 20 November 2007. (EST)
      • In defense of the show, this episode was filmed way before the strike, and written before even that. The writers have always said the last 4 or 5 episodes were the best of the volume, and possibly the best of the series. I don't think the strike has anything to do with that. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 18:48, 20 November 2007 (EST)
        • I have never gasped so loudly, or shouted so loudly at my computer screen. Honestly... just mind-blowing. It's episodes this which remind me why I love Heroes so much. Also, I felt this was probably the first episode this season where they were really confined (for what of a better word) - they weren't jumping in and out of ten stories, but restricted themselves to three perfectly told, perfectly weighted storylines which advanced the plot and gave us some much-needed information. I hear that Noah's "resurrection" was planned to happen next week, or the week after, but I'm glad they did it this week; my worry was that he'd die, and then they'd end on a sappy, soppy, musical montage of tears. Glad that didn't happen! But what an episode! :D--  Lost Soul   talk  contribs  03:45, 21 November 2007 (EST)

Go Matt!

Well, I'm very happy Matt finally got teeth. Adam and Claire can officially resurrect people. Hiro is becoming quite the adult...wow....what an episode.--Mish(Talk) 22:03, 19 November 2007 (EST)

  • How dare he control my poor Angela like that. :[ Speaking of which, does that merit his power to be in line with persuasion? -- Lulu (talk)
    • It's mind control(an interesting kind), not persuasion.--Japanimation 22:08, 19 November 2007 (EST)
      • One could create a case for persuasion being mind control. So, perhaps my question should be, does this merit persuasion being mind control, however, done vocally? -- Lulu (talk)
        • His powers apparently extend to mind control...which rules out the Angela-has-mind-control theory, which would require her to have telepathy, which she could have blocked Matt out (The red headed chick doesnt count)--DarkPhoenix 22:10, 19 November 2007 (EST)
          • This defintely opens a lot of doors...Hmmmm--Japanimation 22:12, 19 November 2007 (EST)
          • She fought against Matt's power and her nose bled like Matt fought against the Haitians power and his nose bled. Mental powers seem to not be absolute.--Riddler 22:13, 19 November 2007 (EST)
          • His power is telepathy why change it to mind control? Telepathy covers that and mind reading.--Mish(Talk) 22:15, 19 November 2007 (EST)
  • Oh and GO WEST! He's turning out to be far less a wuss than I previsouly expected!--Mish(Talk) 22:16, 19 November 2007 (EST)
    • Regarding Angela's power, the last episode seemed to indicate her "persuasion powers" may involve touching, and she wasn't touching Matt in the scene (she was handcuffed down).--Tim Thomason 22:24, 19 November 2007 (EST)
      • I didn't get that she had any kind of "persuasion powers" in the last episode or in this one. In fact, I didn't get that she was exhibiting any powers at all in the last two episodes...or the entire series. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 00:39, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • According to the episode commentary, Angela touching Heidi was Cristine Rose's choice. It wasn't in the script or from the writers. If her power was some kind of touch-based persuasion, it would have been.--Hardvice (talk) 00:49, 20 November 2007 (EST)
        • Cristine may have been doing the touching hoping that the writers would write something like that in, at least that was my first thought about it, anyways; and I think if that's true then it was a good idea on her part.--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:00, 20 November 2007 (EST)

What did we learn tonight?

  1. Bob is the head of the company because "it dies with him".--Mish(Talk) 22:17, 19 November 2007 (EST)
    • Not necessarily - I think the company would have died with him because he produces all the money. That doesn't mean he's the head.Passingtramp 15:43, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • That's splitting hairs. Bob is the money behind the operation. Without his funding, they'd have to resort to bake sales and car washes. What Noah said is astute. - ZachsMind 16:43, 21 November 2007 (EST)
  2. Bob *Bishop* is definitely the father of Elle.--Tim Thomason 22:24, 19 November 2007 (EST)
  3. Joanna Cassidy will be playing Victoria Pratt.--Tim Thomason 22:24, 19 November 2007 (EST)
  4. Ishi Nakamura is no more (and has been since 1990 [subtitle said it was 17 yrs ago]).--Tim Thomason 22:24, 19 November 2007 (EST)
  5. Bob was the "Regional Sales Manager" of Primatech Paper (who was the "CEO" then? Linderman? Petrelli?)--Tim Thomason 22:24, 19 November 2007 (EST)
  6. Bob did horrible things to his own daughter then had the Haitian erase all memory of it.Mish(Talk)
  7. Matt was tempted by the power of his abilities. He may be making a slide into the morally gray...Mish(Talk)
  8. Claire's and Adam's blood can resurrect people.Mish(Talk)
  9. Noah is noticeably concerned about packing Mr. Muggles "doggie bag" (bath?) before they leave Costa Verde. (One of the most dramatic lines in the episode!)--Tim Thomason 22:37, 19 November 2007 (EST)
    • Doggie Bath, it was for the water that made Elle shock herself.--Riddler 22:38, 19 November 2007 (EST)
      • Or it could've been a nice conductor. =P --AnotherNella 22:39, 19 November 2007 (EST)
        • That makes alot more sense now. And here I thought he was being thoughtful for Sandra.--Tim Thomason 22:42, 19 November 2007 (EST)
          • Also, Elle's armed were held down by metal leashes.--Bob (talk) 23:30, 19 November 2007 (EST)
  10. The only members left from the group of twelve are Angela, Victoria, Bob, and Maury.
  11. One possible reason Hiro knew he would one day be able to time travel: he spoke to himself as a kid at the funeral in 1990.
    • That's quite a stretch. Very speculative.--Bob (talk) 23:30, 19 November 2007 (EST)
      • True, it's speculative, but you would think that he would remember the events of his mother's funeral.--MiamiVolts (talk) 23:34, 19 November 2007 (EST)
        • The closer the person to me who died, the less I remember from their funeral. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 00:38, 20 November 2007 (EST)
          • That's kind of sad, but I don't know if it's true in the story. Hiro seemed to be convincing himself that his actions were childish with his speech.--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:05, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  12. Elle looks smokin' in a bikini.
    • Yes, Elle was electrifying tonight. :) What did Bob call Elle's pinpoint shocks (when she shocked the glass of water and broke it into pieces)?--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:05, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • Bob asked how her "sharpshooting" was coming along, because he did not want Elle getting too close to Noah. - ZachsMind 16:54, 21 November 2007 (EST)
  13. Thanks to this image, we now have the names of all the people in Matt's photo.--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:35, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  14. Kaito had never time-travelled before Hiro took him back to revisit his wife's funeral.--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:40, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  15. Adam's blood might have/might be used to resurrect Linderman from the dead.--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:42, 20 November 2007 (EST)

Episode title image for this week

My pick is Hiro in front of his father's tombstone. It's not spoilerish, and it matches the title 'Caution-ary Tales.--MiamiVolts (talk) 23:34, 19 November 2007 (EST)

One thing that did upset me

The whole time Hiro was with Kaito, I expected Kaito to exhibit his power for his son. =[--Riddler 23:50, 19 November 2007 (EST)

  • I assumed he did that when he taught Hiro all those sword skills. But it would have been nice if he revealed his power explicitly to us. Maybe Bennet or Bob'll mention it to Hiro somewhere down the road. Or judging by the "Group of 12" path, Matt'll have a list of powers related to each and every member in a couple of episodes.--Tim Thomason 23:53, 19 November 2007 (EST)
    • I had it set in my mind that it was gonna be like this: "Now I will take us back, father." "No, Hiro... allow me." =/ --AnotherNella 23:55, 19 November 2007 (EST)
      • Then, right before left after saying his goodbyes, Kaito did the scrunchy face! I thought he was going to do something!--Riddler 23:56, 19 November 2007 (EST)
        • That would have been cool...though I was expecting them to go to 1977 in search of answers, not 1990... but I understand that they are saving that part for later. Ishi's death was the same year as the Golden Handshake story, so the whole time of the funeral I was expecting to see other members of the twelve. Anyways, great episode.--MiamiVolts (talk) 23:58, 19 November 2007 (EST)
          • Kaito did say "We have the power of gods." -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 00:37, 20 November 2007 (EST)
            • Wasn't it rumored that Kaito's powers would be revealed in episode one of this season, as stated by Takei himself? I'm wondering if there was a scene filmed that got deleted? --PeterDawson 01:15, 20 November 2007 (EST)
              • It was also confirmed that some of the rumours that were going around were false, but we still might see Kaito's power assuming we have a segment in 1977.--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:22, 20 November 2007 (EST)
                • Yeah, but I'm pretty sure that rumor came from George Takei's mouth during the Howard Stern Show. You'd think there would be some credibility to it. --PeterDawson 01:45, 20 November 2007 (EST)
                • So why dont any of the kids even seem curious as to what their parent can do? It's almost borderline creepy that they dont ask. --Mish(Talk) 08:18, 20 November 2007 (EST)

Victoria Pratt as Victoria Pratt???

I think it would be cool if the rl actress Victoria Pratt could star as her namesake when they do a Vietnam era episode. Wishful thinking? Doesn't she look like a young Joanna Cassidy? (rl Victoria Pratt's IMDb page: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0695560/) --MiamiVolts (talk) 23:58, 19 November 2007 (EST)

  • Are you the one that posted the trivia about the name? If so, I should point out that the WB did not own rights to Mutant X, the show was made entirely for syndication with no specific parent network, unlike most shows. --PeterDawson 01:39, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • Peter, good catch. I'll substitute the syndication company's name as soon as I can find it. There may/may not be a 1977 episode, but I'm hoping there is one.--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:46, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • Tribute Entertainment distributed it in North America (Global, WB, maybe another network or two) and Fireworks Entertainment produced it and helped distribute it. Might as well call it a Tribute-Fireworks joint if anything. --PeterDawson 01:55, 20 November 2007 (EST)
        • If you read Wikipedia carefully, you'll note it's really Tribune (not Tribute) Entertainment, which is part of WB. I reworded it, but feel free to clarify further.--MiamiVolts (talk) 02:00, 20 November 2007 (EST)
          • I skimmed the show's old homepage, I didn't use wikipedia. I also a mention about Global since they have ties to Fireworks and distributed the show during the show's original run. Probably the closest thing Global had to original programming. --PeterDawson 02:10, 20 November 2007 (EST)
            • Please add GlobalTV, then, if you think they were also distributors. My impression was that GlobalTV aired the show, but they were buying the rights from Tribune in the US.--MiamiVolts (talk) 02:15, 20 November 2007 (EST)
              • Nah, that's what they do with Heroes. They bought syndication rights from Fireworks while the WB and I think Sci-Fi or something similar did the same with Tribune. --PeterDawson 14:17, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • 1977 episode? Dean Harper 01:40, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • Rumor has it there's going to be an episode, or at least a part of one, set in 1977 which covers the original twelve. --PeterDawson 01:44, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • Now that I think more about it, the reason I'm thinking this is cause there were rumors of a casting call for a young Joanna Cassidy, and Joanna is in Matt's photo in 1977, so it would probably be Vietnam era for the younger version if I'm correct.--MiamiVolts (talk) 02:34, 20 November 2007 (EST)

Credits

$%&@!!!

They shouldn't have brought Mr. Bennet back to life! Deux Ex Machina! >:( >:( >:( --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 01:05, 20 November 2007 (EST)

  • Looks like Mr. Bennet and Hana still have a chance to get together, but how does he escape Primatech this time?--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:09, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • Not technically a DEM but w/e--Meatydoughnut (talk) 17:13, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • Anytime can be a rescue time. Maybe Claire will ask Peter for help. ANYTHING is within the realm of possibility. Cept Bennet with Hana, cause she's dead. But other than that, yeah. I've read that the finale has one hell of a cliffhanger, so I am quite excited. Maybe Mohinder hasn't gone native... maybe it was a giant plan. Not everything is what it seems. Ever. Maybe he'll find Arthur Petrelli in the facility! --PsymonM77 (talk)
  • I'm really hoping they close the "magic blood" loophole somehow. It makes the show less dramatic and a a little cheap if they can always just inject a little Clairejuice in the latest dead body and bring them back.--Hardvice (talk) 22:38, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • It certainly cheapens the death of a character. Then again, she (and her blood) cant be every where. MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA!!! lol --Mish(Talk) 22:40, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • Indeed, and Hiro can never seem to save anyone when he goes back in time. Charlie, his dad... --PeterDawson 11:01, 21 November 2007 (EST)
        • But he saved Peter...--MiamiVolts (talk) 12:45, 21 November 2007 (EST)

Screencaps

File is loading now, should be up in a few minutes. Requests, above and beyond the obvious stuff?--Hardvice (talk) 01:11, 20 November 2007 (EST)

  • Hiro seeing himself as a kid with a toy sword in his face, Bennet shot (obvious one), Bob introducing Mohinder to Elle. Those are my three main picks. --PeterDawson 01:13, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • If you can get a 450x350 shot of the street signs (Ocean Avenue & 4th Street or Verbena Street & Palm Drive), it'd make a good lead image for our list of roads.
  • Good luck with the monks.
    • Figuring out who was who was easy (Noriaki Ito's distinctive features FTW). Getting a shot of monk II sucked.--Hardvice (talk) 03:18, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • Well done. I didn't think they showed the chanting monks' faces at all--I only remember them from behind. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 06:23, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • There were a couple cars, including Noah's car and Bob's car. I'd like good shots just for the license plates.
  • Who is the blonde cheerleader right next to Claire? She looks like Rachelle Jacoby, but that wouldn't make sense.
    • Definitely looks like her. Maybe after Debbie got the boot, they let some of the other girls in, too.--Hardvice (talk) 12:58, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • Enough to say it's her? I rewound it a few times, but it was hard to tell without HD. Is that a second appearance for her? -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 14:33, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • Not a screencap, but if you can ID the song the cheerleaders are dancing to, that'd be great for the soundtrack.
  • Thanks, as always, Hardvice! You make our site look beautiful. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 01:28, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • Please add Hiro talking to his younger self, the reveal of the hooded killer's identity, and Elle shocking the airborne West and Claire. Also, Hiro at the podium in front of his father's tombstone during the funeral, for use as the title screenshot.--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:30, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • Elle in a bikini. :) --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 01:39, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • As much as I'd like this, there are much better photos of Kristen online.--Bob (talk) 02:35, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • I'd like to see the shot of Bob's face when Elle says she wants to keep Mohinder. That'd be great for the family page.--Bob (talk) 02:35, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • We're going to need a shot of Hiro as a kid since it will be the only shot we have of Sekai Murashige (I couldn't find anything online, though I do believe he is represented by or has some affiliation with The Actors Circle). -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 06:26, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • Is there something on Elle's thigh in the bikini photos or is it just a distorion of the NBC logo?
    • I'm not positive, but it looks like a reflection from the pool. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 14:34, 20 November 2007 (EST)

References to past episodes

Quite a few of them, weren't there? 'I'm just a cheerleader.' The car ride scene. Claire saying Noah can't be trusted. Lyle calling his sister crazy. The Holy sh- scene. Not to mention the 9th episode in both seasons featured a showdown of sorts and had Hiro go back in time. They sure weren't kidding about making it more like the 1st season. --PeterDawson 01:12, 20 November 2007 (EST)

Not to mention when Claire jumped off the Hollywood sign, West saved her by catching her and flying with her (past episode, not sure which), and when West was hit by Elle's lightning, Claire used her Rapid Cell Regeneration to save him from dying in this episode. Dean Harper 22:37, 21 November 2007 (EST)

Maya y Alejandro?

The writing on the front page clearly state that they are in the episode, but i didnt see 'em... just a typo? Dean Harper 01:47, 20 November 2007 (EST)

  • I guess they decided to move that plot to the next episode. --PeterDawson 01:53, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • That's one reason we don't use the NBC summaries as Heroes Wiki summaries after the episode airs. They are often filled with mistakes, major omissions, and sometimes even the wrong storylines. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 02:04, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • It also said that Peter was in the episode and he wasn't. Still until you've Australian adds... --  Seclusion  talk / contribs 05:26, 20 November 2007 (EST)
  • Maya? Alejandro? I didn't even miss them. Maybe we'll get lucky and Sylar will kill them both. :) --Mish(Talk) 10:14, 20 November 2007 (EST)

Heroes Interactive

I have stored on my PC the screenshots of the Heroes Interactive from tonight's show, but it's late so I plan to add it tommorrow. If anyone else has the info. and wants to take a crack at it, feel free.--MiamiVolts (talk) 02:39, 20 November 2007 (EST)

Memorable Quotes

The quote I added "You've gone native!", fits into the criteria of Help:Memorable_quotes. It is representative of the scene in the car where a major plot point in the show takes places. Mohinder reveals to Noah his intention to betray him and essentially hand over his daughter to the company. As well it was an awesome quote delivered in wonderful way by Jack Coleman. Humorous but to the point. Oddly enough it was the line that 3 of my co-workers also mentioned this morning when we were talking about the show. Although the quote, "What's your superpower? Punching Bag?", while very funny, probably does not meet the criteria for a memorable quote.--Mish(Talk) 13:14, 20 November 2007 (EST)

  • "You've gone native" is, I beleive, an example of a memorable scene that it is of a quote. --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 13:21, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • The reason why I removed any quotes were due to the fact that the section was getting long, yet no one has even started on the synopsis. It looks unbalanced, and I tried to make it shorter. That being said, Joe (the writer of this episode) is good at making memorable quotes, so for me, I think that we should shy away from any line that may be slightly amusing, when we should stick to quotes that stand out from the rest of the dialogue. All lines in the show are memorable if you want to put a specific criterion, because it's all subjective. My belief is something like the punching bag line is something that stands out. "You've gone native" isn't even the strongest line in that scene, so I don't see how it's a memorable quote. I just get disappointed when we have a dozen contributors expanding a section on quotes when they could use their memory to help expand something that doesn't exist, like the synopsis.--Bob (talk) 14:16, 20 November 2007 (EST)
      • No need for expending memory, since the quote was very memorable. As a note I did Claire during my last break, and I plan on doing more during the next one. :) --Mish(Talk) 14:33, 20 November 2007 (EST)

Hiro's Monologue at the end

I'm not sure where I can put this, but I figured it would be as a blurb thingy at the end of the episode's synopsis, but that's not done now, so here you go: --MeliPetrelli 13:17, 20 November 2007 (EST)

  • I refuse to eulogize my father. To eulogize him is to admit he is gone. My father is not dead... Kaito Nakamura taught me right from wrong. What it means to be a hero... So long as the lessons live on through me... he will never die. My father taught me to understand that... certain things are in God's hands. But for everything else... God has given us the gift of choice. My father gave me the tools to fight the battles ahead. Every hand I extend in kindness is his hand. And every blow that I strike for justice is his fist. So long as the lessons he taught me stay with me. And so long as he lives on in my heart. Then my father is never truly dead.

So...

...In "Four Months Later...", Kaito clearly states that there are nine members of the Group of Twelve left. Papa Petrelli, Linderman, and Charles Deveaux were all deceased. Then Kaito himself died, leaving eight people left. If we mark off Mama Petrelli, Bob, Maury, and Victoria Pratt, because they're all still alive, there are four people that have been stated to be deceased: Suzanne Ammaw, Carlos Mendez, Harry Fletcher, and Paula Gramble. Since the only dead ones in Four Months Later are Arthur, Linderman, and Deveaux, the remaining four must have been alive them. Are we assuming that Maury/Adam managed to kill four elders off in the span of a week, or what? And why does nobody care about them? :( Thrashmeister 20:57, 20 November 2007 (EST)

  • I'm assuming Kaito hasn't contacted any of the twelve (except for Angela) since at least 1990. So they easily could have passed away of natural causes between then and 2007. --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 21:08, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • But if he knew about the deaths of Petrelli, Linderman, and Deveaux, there's no reason why he shouldn't have known about the deaths of the other four people. Thrashmeister 11:34, 22 November 2007 (EST)
      • He may have been in contact with Angela, who was aware of the deaths of Linderman, Petrelli, and Deveaux, because of her proximity to those people, but perhaps not of the others. Illusionist1920 00:23, 24 November 2007 (EST)
    • Yeah, and in discussing the photo with Angela, Matt said that the rest, except for Angela, Maury, Bob and Victoria, were already dead. It is sad, but hopefully there will be a 1977 scene so we can meet them when they were living.--MiamiVolts (talk) 21:17, 20 November 2007 (EST)
    • He could of also just been using characters we know as an example as to what's happening, as to opposed to people we've never seen before. --  Seclusion  talk / contribs 21:13, 20 November 2007 (EST)

Synopsis

I'll start the synopsis if no one else is going to. If you are going to work on it, please tell me so I don't work on something someones already done. --  Seclusion  talk / contribs 21:15, 20 November 2007 (EST)

  • Okay done, It may be a bit small since it look bigger in word. --  Seclusion  talk / contribs 02:15, 21 November 2007 (EST)

Where was the Haitian?

In the episode before last, The Haitian was with Noah in Russia. Somewhere between Russia and California, Noah misplaced him. Yet there's no explanation. No scene in which we see The Haitian tell Noah that he's got tickets to see Avril Lavigne at the Gibson and can't help his old partner save his daughter. Am I the only one who sees this as a major plot hole? Had the Haitian been in the mix this episode things woulda gone a lot differently. - ZachsMind 16:27, 21 November 2007 (EST)

  • The Haitian? Isn't he in Haiti? :) --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 16:38, 21 November 2007 (EST)
    • We're in Haiti.--Riddler 17:27, 21 November 2007 (EST)
    • I loved that quote. =) Anyway, I'm pretty sure the Haitian just left Noah temporarily, like he has done before. I don't think the Haitian is going to be around Noah 24/7 like he needs a babysitter.--Ice Vision 19:12, 21 November 2007 (EST)
  • Noah and the Hatian took separate flights back from the Ukraine. Maybe Noah took an Air France flight from Paris to New York with a Delta flight to LA and Delta Connection to Costa Verde, while the Haitian flew to Miami from Paris followed by a AA flight to Port-au-Prince? After all, they're no longer working for the company, so clearly these airline tickets came out of their own frequent flyer miles. --TRECORD-- Talk/Contrib 19:05, 21 November 2007 (EST)

Story Development

  • Don't we usually just list new articles?--Hardvice (talk) 02:26, 22 November 2007 (EST)
    • New and developed articles. E.g Matt's powers have developed to a point we haven't seen before, so thats development. --  Seclusion  talk / contribs 02:40, 22 November 2007 (EST)
      • We've never listed developed articles before this episode, though, to my knowledge. Just new ones.--Hardvice (talk) 03:09, 22 November 2007 (EST)
  • Actually, we have. The Shanti virus was one, and I think we listed Adam Monroe two weeks in a row. --Bob (talk) 03:10, 22 November 2007 (EST)
    • Ok, well, then, prior to the last three episodes, we've never listed updated articles. I just checked the first twenty-nine. There are a few repeats, but generally they're because articles were merged (lightning) or because we were wrong about or unable to determine someone's identity (Takezo Kensei/fake Takezo Kensei, BWMSM/Maury Parkman).--Hardvice (talk) 03:14, 22 November 2007 (EST)
      • We could certainly stand to have some standardization for that section. I don't care if we just list articles that are new, or if we list articles that are developing, but some form of guidelines needs to be developed. I hate seeing every single new article (inconsistently) listed there. Do we really need Safeline guard (I) listed in the story development for Kindred? I mean, how much impact did he really have on the development of the story? -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 03:18, 22 November 2007 (EST)
        • I'd love to see it developed into a more useful tool (or scrapped--I'm mercurial like that). (Incidentally, one season one episode doesn't have one). I'm not sure about what kind of guidelines we could use, though. Lots of seemingly important things end up being trivial (McSorley) and vice-versa.--Hardvice (talk) 03:22, 22 November 2007 (EST)
          • This doesn't really help, but another pet peeve is when it's included on the main page (again, inconsistently) with red links all over it. And silly red links at that. I just don't like seeing red links on the main page, ya know? -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 03:24, 22 November 2007 (EST)
            • Or when it has commas instead of bullets.--Hardvice (talk) 03:49, 22 November 2007 (EST)
          • For me, I think that reducing red links and having pertinent links to the plot definitely serve the purpose of the template to begin with. For me, the bar gives links to the pertinent plot points of the episode. We didn't learn anything about Niki and the virus, but we learned more about Adam and the group of twelve, as well as the paintings and Elle. So those should be some of the things that are on that, as a way to highlight the important progressions in the show. In a way, the bullets that summarize the show highlight the main points, but for me, the story development template highlights the developing plot points.--Bob (talk) 05:16, 22 November 2007 (EST)
          • Do you think that we should have something like: Matt's developed telepathy - Issac's fullfiled paintings - Elle's non-immunity.? --  Seclusion  talk / contribs 05:40, 22 November 2007 (EST)
            • That works. I think Bob is really on the right track. I'd rather not see a list of new articles that come from the episode, but of plot points that really develop. "What did we learn?" is a great question to ask ourselves when filling in the bar. It's still subjective, but it gives us a bit of direction and purpose. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 10:31, 22 November 2007 (EST)

Date My Dad

I know it is sacrilege, but the scene on the beach is visibly inspired by the final scene of every MTV's "Date My Mum" with the three silhouettes waiting beside a car and the other three arriving! And it fits to all the Freud about choosing your friend... (--Juba 12:48, 7 April 2008 (EDT):-)

Noah, shouldn't have healed. According to Angela Petrelli&Co ?

I watched this episode again and at the very end of the episode we see Noah, who had been shot in the head, heal and come back to life. But if Adam or Claire can't heal themself after being shot in the head, how come this same injury can be healed with Noah.

I already came up with my own counter-arguments, but I'm not sure.

- Noah's injury could be healed because the healing property came from an outside source, Claire's blood. And this injury is only fatal to humans who'd have to rely on themselfs to regulate the healing progress, through their ability. DarthYotho 16:17, 3 August 2008 (EDT)

  • Angela is wrong/lying. Claire and Peter have recovered from damage caused to the brain. The only difference is that someone had to remove the object that caused the wound. Also, in How to Stop an Exploding Man, Peter ordered Claire to shoot him in the head, implying that he would be all right. Mohinder probably removed the bullet from Noah's eye before injecting him with the blood. We don't know, however, how it works with decapitation.--Referos 16:25, 3 August 2008 (EDT)
    • Peter's instruction to Claire, imho, is a sacrifice, in that he knows it will stop him, even if it means his death. Normally, a bullet should pass through a human skull from point blank, meaning they should be able to heal. However, it's very apparent that while there is something in the brain, the abilities do not work.--Bob (talk) 01:09, 4 August 2008 (EDT)

Narration

Does Hiro's speech count as narration? If so, it should be treated just as Mohinder's, Linderman's, Nathan's, or Sylar's and added at the end of the synopsis. -- Tristan0709 talk 03:15, 8 April 2009 (EDT)