Episode talk:Distractions

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Screencaps here

Synopsis

  • I'm not going to be able to write a synopsis until Tuesday evening, so if someone else wants to take this one go right ahead. Even a short synopsis would be good, I can always go back and write a long one like I usually do. If not then it'll be up by tomorrow night! :) (Admin 23:06, 5 February 2007 (EST))
    • That does not sound like a fun job. I'll work on the manatees and waffles. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 23:16, 5 February 2007 (EST)
      • Mmmmm. Waffles. -- ZachsMind 17:31, 6 February 2007 (EST)
        • How come we don't have the epiosde synopsis yet!? Heroe 19:29, 6 February 2007 (EST)
          • That's generally Admin's job, and he said he won't be able to do it until Tuesday evening. (See above.) I guess he's slacking. :) — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 20:30, 6 February 2007 (EST)
            • Admin, hurry up and right that synopsis already! Heroe 10:42, 7 February 2007 (EST)
              • Sorry, sorry, I'll try to get to it tonight. :) Been a very busy week so far. (Admin 10:53, 7 February 2007 (EST))
                • There's no need to be sorry, it's not your job. Any of us slackers can do it just as easily! (Though, for the record, you're still a big slacker...) :) — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 11:02, 7 February 2007 (EST)

Peter's fall

  • Did anyone else notice the car he fell on had a sign that said "Nakamura"? 23:23, 5 February 2007 (EST)
    • The sign ends in "...amura", but it looks like there's a c or o before that. It is subtitled "Warriors of Edo Japan" whatever that means. The picture next to it looks like Takezo Kensei. --Fcphantom 23:42, 5 February 2007 (EST)

Episode image

Okay, the term "distractions" was used when Kaito was talking to Hiro. Should we use this as the episode image (it's a closeup profile of Katio, Hiro in the background)? — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 23:44, 5 February 2007 (EST)

  • I like this one because it has a couple layers to it. Kaito and Kiminimimana (sp? ;) ) think Hiro's distracted from his true purpose, and they're serving as a distraction from his quest.--Hardvice (talk) 02:39, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Meredith's travels

Is the mere mention of a location really worth an article? I'd say if we've at least seen it, then go for it (and before anyone says anything, yes, we have seen Germany), but otherwise, it seems unnecessary for now.--Hardvice (talk) 02:38, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Agree to a point. Unless it serves some larger purpose, there's no need in making a page for it. Now, if the necklace turns out to be some big plot point thing, then maybe the place that it's from would be a good article because, though unseen, it serves as an important story point. (See Lake Ramsey.) Until then, I think those places are just fine on Meredith's page. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 02:56, 6 February 2007 (EST)
The part about her being in Mexico felt important to me (after Claire's reaction), but the rest of the locations were forgetable.--Yoshie (talk) 10:41, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Sylar's Voice

Did anyone notice that Sylar's voice changed when he loomed over Sandra? Was that the same sound modification as Eden's power? Webrunner 11:01, 6 February 2007 (EST)

  • Could have been. It's not likely that Sylar was able to aquire Eden's ability though, and if he had.. wouldn't he have used it by now? (rather than faking his death, and then TKing everyone)? It might have been an ability we have not yet seen (he's supposed to have killed several other metahumans, though again.. we have only actually seen him use his own ability and the TK thus far). I'm starting to wonder if Sylar's ability requires him to "see" the ability being used in order to aquire it, as he's just not showing signs of having any others at present.--Yoshie (talk) 11:12, 6 February 2007 (EST)
    • If he has a variant of Peter Petrelli's power, he may just have to be in close proximity for a short while, which Sylar was with Eden. And, like Peter, Sylar may not have developed a reliable way to manifest the stored powers. This was a situation (if I recall) where Sylar was attempting to "command" Mrs Bennet, and the power expressed. Though, Sylar believes he can "analyze" his way into understanding the powers, which may be why he needs to cut open the brains, and through "logic" (rather than Peter's "empathy") he may call up the stored ability --Orne 12:07, 6 February 2007 (EST)
      • Personally, I just thought it was the Zachary Quinto going from his Southern Charmer/T-Bag voice to his Serial Killer/Buffalo Bill voice. I took it as Sylar revealing himself, nothing more. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 17:10, 6 February 2007 (EST)
        • Agreed. They made a big deal of Eden sacrificing herself to keep Sylar from getting her power. --Ted C 17:13, 6 February 2007 (EST)
          • Or perhaps Eden thought she sacrificed herself, but instead only gave Sylar bite sized nuggets to 'study' before he was apprehended. Shooting herself in the head wouldn't have guaranteed ruining Sylar's fun. Or maybe he TK'd her into shooting herself because he felt too weak to cut her head open himself. -- ZachsMind 17:27, 6 February 2007 (EST)
            • Err, no. It was just Sylar revealing his true personality because he didn't need the disguise anymore, and Eden just plain killed herself so that he couldn't take her power. I hate inane theories. SpACatta 13:03, 5 October 2007 (EDT)

Req: Definition of "series regular"

Seeing as I've now had a half dozen entries removed due to "not a series regular"-related reasons, I'd like to know who exactly is considered a series regular and why.--Yoshie 13:11, 6 February 2007 (EST)
I dunno about the official reason as this Wiki and the people behind it might define, but here's how I define 'regular' as opposed to supporting or recurring. In the advertising of the series from the beginning the NBC network has presented eleven, and sometimes twelve, faces. Left to right on the front page of the nbc.com/heroes website at the moment it's Peter, Claire, D.L., Micha, Nathan, Niki/Jess, Matt, Mohinder, Isaac, Hiro, and Simone. Early in the series, Horn Rimmed Glasses guy seemed like the baddie, but as we get to know Mr. Bennet more he is slowly inching into potential regular status. After all he has been with the series since the first commercial break. Sylar's become the major bad guy, but things are about to shake up and people are gonna start taking sides as we fly into the second season. Anyone outside the primary eleven though is technically just a 'supporting' character. In fact I'd argue against Simone and Mohinder being primary, if not for the official network advertising. Simone supports Isaac and Peter. Ando supports Hiro. If Simone's a 'regular' then Ando must be too. -- ZachsMind 13:29, 6 February 2007 (EST)
It's really simple. A "series regular" is somebody who is listed as a series regular in the credits. They appear in the opening credits (and get paid), whether they're in the episode or not, before the "guest star" label. The only reason we note when series regulars don't appear is because they are credited either way. It's not something we made up -- it's an actual different role. Right now, everyone who's a series regular is in Portal:Main Characters. Mr. Bennet is the last addition to the regular cast, having been promoted as of Six Months Ago.--Hardvice (talk) 13:40, 6 February 2007 (EST)
It's a good explanation (especially about HRG's "promotion"), however.. none of the "mains" that were absent had their named appear in the credits - I watched the intro to be sure. Mostly, I was curious to know if there was an "official" definition, or just something made up to fit whomever was editing at that time.--Yoshie (talk) 13:55, 6 February 2007 (EST)
Hmmm. Most series continue to credit them (and Heroes has from time to time ... Leonard Roberts was credited on early episodes). They definitely still get paid. But yes, "series regular" is an industry term, not one we made up.--Hardvice (talk) 13:58, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Title Commentary

Should there be a section to each episode page denoting why the episode is called what it is, or what references in the episode harken back to the title? Sometimes it's not obvious, and sometimes there's multiple reasons. Like in this episode, it's called Distractions perhaps because Hiro's father actually uses that word in his dialogue, but it's also because Peter learns that distractions are what keep his power from happening. It's when he focuses on someone with a power that he emulates that power. One could also argue that Claire is distracted from going to school because she has to meet her real mom. Sylar's appearance in the Bennet house distracts Mrs. Bennet. Mister Muggles distracted her from telling us Mr. Bennet's name. I can't figure out how Jessica's plotline ties in to it this week, but aside from her, the episode is chock full of distractions. Should there be a place in each episode's page that's devoted to examples referencing the episode title, or is that a bit of overkill? Heck, we're wiki-ing the show what's not overkill? =) -- ZachsMind 13:17, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Hmm. If we did, it would have to be a fan creation since it's not canon. My concern is that it would invite a lot of speculation. But in the end, this is a fan site, and I suppose we can make a page if we wanted. I just wouldn't put it on the main article space. There's just a lot of ... guesswork involved, and people will have wildly different opinions. I'm afraid of edit wars and too much discussion about nonissues. But I suppose it wouldn't hurt.... My only other pet peeve is if we started spoonfeeding fans, telling them what an episode title means. It must be the educator in me, but I'm much more about letting people discover what the word genesis means, or drawing their own ideas about the distractions in the show. I wouldn't want to be patronizing. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 17:18, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Hank

I went ahead and scratched Hank off. His section would have looked like this:

===Distractions===
Hank is still dead.

--Hardvice (talk) 17:03, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Funny, I actually just came to this page to do the same. (Um, Golden Moms' T&A?) We didn't mention every character that was briefly flashbacked (flashforwarded?) at the end of Six Months Ago, and we didn't put a reference to everybody that appeared in Peter's vision at the end of Fallout. Hanks (re)appearance, to me, is along those same lines. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 17:22, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Quotes

I'm feeling a little bit anxious about some of the quotes that we're adding. I kind of feel that, with very very few exceptions, the quotes should be a small "snippet" of conversation; they really shouldn't be extended transcriptions of the show. I think they should generally be one liners, illustrative citations, and just really memorable moments. Besides possible copyright violations, I'm afraid that the really long quotes become unreadable. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 18:24, 6 February 2007 (EST)

  • In general, I think we have far too many quotes on the last couple episodes. Three or four is probably plenty, maybe five if they're all really good. But a lot of them have been kind of crap. If anybody's super devoted to to them, I'd suggest we farm some out to the character pages, rather than having half the script on the episode page.--Hardvice (talk) 18:45, 6 February 2007 (EST)
    • I very much so agree very much to a great extent a lot a whole bunch lots. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 20:30, 6 February 2007 (EST)
      • A big me three here! --Fcphantom 21:38, 6 February 2007 (EST)
        • I disagree strongly -- ZachsMind 01:22, 7 February 2007 (EST)
          • The edits, I assume, were not made to be taken personally. We run into a few problems with quoting long passages. Besides the fact that it's hard to read on the page and disrupts the flow, quoting an extended section could be a copyright violation. That said, I agree with you that the quotes you added are good information. I don't see any reason why they can't be added to the site — I would try to sprinkle them out in different articles, though. For instance, part of the quote your referenced would be much better suited on empathic mimicry. I would also trim it down so it has just the essence of the information; the rest should be paraphrased and summarized in the article space (the Limits section is a perfect for that). Plus, a streamlined quote is more likely to be read by more people. Especially when they're eating manatees. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 01:28, 7 February 2007 (EST)
  • I wanted to add the "Son of a bitch." (Peter to Claude), but I wonder if I should... Anyway, it's shorter than one line !!! =) --FrenchFlo.(talk).(contribs) 16:41, 7 February 2007 (EST)

Quotes, pt 2

On the Isaac/Mr. Bennet dialog, you've edited my "doesn't" for "isn't". I thought it was "isn't" too but I've got the episode in my pc (the show doesn't air where I live) and I can assure you that Mr. Bennet says "doesn't". --Densus 10:48, 8 February 2007 (GMT)

No, he says "an old friend isn't quite as dead", but the d from friend blends into the isn't, so it sounds like "friendisn't", which could be mistaken for the grammatically incorrect "an old friend doesn't quite as dead". — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 06:15, 8 February 2007 (EST)
Thanks. I'm portuguese. I know english and all, but I'm not an expert so, "doesn't" could've been an option that I didn't know of. --Densus 11:41, 8 February 2007 (GMT)
No problem. Glad to have you on board! :) — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 07:01, 8 February 2007 (EST)
Thank you for your welcome =) --Densus 08:16, 8 February 2007 (EST)

Synopsis, pt. 2

The synopsis really needs some work. Besides grammatical errors, there are a lot of holes remaining. It's just not really up to par with our other episode synopses yet — the others are a lot more factually written and rarely gloss over important details. I think it needs a big overhaul. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 10:12, 8 February 2007 (EST)

I didn't write one yesterday because I saw someone else had, but I can go ahead and write a synopsis for it sometime soon so it'll look similar to all the previous ones that I wrote. (Admin 10:52, 8 February 2007 (EST))
That'd be really nice for the consistency. I like your writing style, too, Admin. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 12:05, 8 February 2007 (EST)

Quotes, pt. 3

The memorable quotes section is now longer than the synopsis in terms of screen real estate.--Hardvice (talk) 10:56, 8 February 2007 (EST)

  • This was a very quotable episode, but I still fail to comprehend why some are being left and others are being removed. There seems to be no rhyme or reason to it. Perhaps we need a Heroes WikiQuotes as well? Or at least a page for memorable dialogue, separate from the episode summary pages. -- ZachsMind 11:50, 8 February 2007 (EST)
    • Perhaps we should scrap the synopsis in favor of a written transcript? Or better yet, let's just scrap the whole page and replace it with this link. :) — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 12:05, 8 February 2007 (EST)
      • Another solution (and I'm not actually kidding) would be to go through the site and scrap all the memorable quotes sections. If we can't come up with a good solution short of quoting the whole episode, and if it's going to continue to be such an enormous problem, then we should just ditch them. There are other sites that host transcripts and second-by-second screencaps if people want to relive the episodes. What should and shouldn't be in a quotes section is entirely subjective, so we're left with either allowing complete anarchy (which leads to lower-quality articles and a quotes section nobody's going to bother to read) or individual judgment calls (which leads to in-fighting, the appearance of elitism, and perpetual edit wars.)--Hardvice (talk) 12:18, 8 February 2007 (EST)
        • Another possible option is to set up rules for the quotes that can be added such as the number of people the dialogue can be between and how many lines it can be. Though I do agree that it's very subjective and probably adds little actual value. (Admin 12:29, 8 February 2007 (EST))
        • I don't think there's a perfect solution, but I'm tending to lean towards scrapping all the quotes (at least on the episode pages). The one thing I think we're all agreeing on is that there's no standard. And there's really no reason for the quotes, other than they're just cool. If they're that illustrative, then they can be either paraphrased or actually quoted in the history section. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 12:35, 8 February 2007 (EST)
          • Even moving quotes to other articles gets to be problematic. Since there's only one "Claire Bennet" page for all of the episodes, if we farm all the Claire Bennet quotes out to her page, by the end of the season it'll be worse than any episode page. Hmmm.--Hardvice (talk) 12:40, 8 February 2007 (EST)
    • I recommend just migrating some of these to the appropriate Character pages again until we have just a few on the episode page. --Ted C 12:07, 8 February 2007 (EST)
    • Since different people have done the removing, there are probably different reasons, and thus it appears there's no rhyme or reason to it. Personally, I'd rather wait and then remove the least memorable, rather than merely keeping the oldest or the shortest, which is what people seem to be doing. A lot of people adding quotes seem to be confusing "memorable scenes" with "memorable quotes" -- just because something comes off well on-screen doesn't mean it makes for a great quote (Hiro's subtitled "GULP" from The Fix is a great example). I wouldn't even care except that all of the previous episodes have at most a handful of quotes. The inconsistency is very noticeable if you're browsing through the episodes. It seems kind of out of left field to suddenly have nine or ten quotes, many of which aren't particularly memorable. As for a page of just quotes, that's a good solution, but it's a really bad idea from a copyright viewpoint. Quotes on an episode summary are illustrative. Quotes on their own is just posting somebody else's IP (what the case law calls "base copying") and a lot less likely to stand up as fair use.--Hardvice (talk) 12:08, 8 February 2007 (EST)
      • I for one would hate to see the quotes disappear from the wiki, but I'm also not in favor of there being 'rules' for their placement. I'd be in favor of seeing quotations scattered throughout the wikinode gel as such a quote might illuminate or illustrate something in the prose of say a summary or a point being made on some page. Some find quotations unruly and think they throw off the flow of a page, but I love'm. Maybe the problem isn't that there's too many quotes, but that we're not putting the quotes in places where they'd do the most good. A quote about Claire meeting her mom for the first time might be useful on Claire's page or Claire's mom's page. Just mushing all the quotes together on an episode page does inundate that page and lessens the usefulness and impact. -- ZachsMind 13:11, 8 February 2007 (EST)
        • I agree that rules would cause more problems than they'd solve. We'd lose good quotes that are too long, and people would feel "justified" adding pointless quotes with no context merely because they fit the rules. As for the quotes on other pages: we do have quotes sections on some non-episode pages, but as a long-term solution, that's problematic, too. We're stuck with one Claire pages and one Hiro page forever, so if we move all the good Claire and Hiro quotes there, then pretty soon we'll be having the same discussion on Talk:Claire Bennet--Hardvice (talk) 13:18, 8 February 2007 (EST)
          • My $0.02 since I'm a bit of a quote-nazi: episode pages should have just a few (say, five or less) memorable quotes from the episode. I prefer the humerous quotes, but big-moment quotes are great too if the quote stands on its own outside the context of the scene. Things like "Find him. He dies" feel pretty useless to me, however I wouldn't mind seeing a seperate "Quotes:Distractions" page that people could put whatever they want on. As for character and other pages, I think the quotes should only be added if it has some specific insite into the person/place/etc. My favorite example is Charles Deveaux's rooftop. --Fcphantom 13:44, 8 February 2007 (EST)

I took a shot at trimming down the list by hiding some quotes instead of outright deleting them. I put my reasons in the comment tags. --Ted C 13:46, 8 February 2007 (EST)

  • I think you did a great job, and I agree completely with the suggestions you commented out, Ted C. BTW, the only time I remember distraction being said was by Kaito. Dr. Witherspoon, or whatever we want to call her now, may have said it too. I don't have the recordings here at work to verify. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 14:14, 8 February 2007 (EST)
    • I believe Claude said something to Peter about him having too many distractions to focus on developing control of his power. This would have been shortly after they got back together following the purse-snatching incident, IIRC. --Ted C 14:33, 8 February 2007 (EST)
I really wish everyone would come to a consensus about quotes
User:Hardvice, to User:Ryangibsonstewart
([[Talk:Episode:Distractions]])

I think we're all completely failing to utilize quotations the way they should be used. Quotes are like screencaps. They should appear in the nodegel of any page wherever they'd help illustrate a point of reference. When you show the image of Hiro with arms outstretched in Times Square, it'd be completely acceptable to also show the quotation "YATTA!" In fact one could opt to put "YATTA!" - Hiro as an alternative to posting the image. In some cases when a page is inundated with graphics, a quotation might be more beneficial, breaking up the page with some variety. Instead of separating the quotations from the synopsis, or doing a full transcript, it'd be ideal to summarize the plots, and then use quotations to highlight particularly good moments of dialogue from the episode. Dismissing quotations entirely, or segregating them to a subsection or page where people won't read them, is just as absurd as removing screencaps and images from the wiki, or relegating them to their own separate pages. -- ZachsMind 14:21, 12 February 2007 (EST)

  • I certainly think it's possible to treat quotes similarly to screencaps and have it work out. Sticking them in a bordered div, like a thumbnailed pic, in a larger font, possibly a different color and typeface, and floating them to the sides would I think work quite well in some instances. That said, that doesn't solve the problem of too many quotes (or low quality quotes). These articles are like cookies: the text is the dough, the pictures are like nuts, and the quotes are like chocolate. As it stands, we're using quotes like ganache, and what you're proposing is using them like chocolate chips. That's great, but too many nuts and chips and you don't have a cookie ... you have a big, sticky, crunchy, overly sweet mess. The point is that some restraint, some quality control, and some proportioning is required to make any plan for integrating quotes work. I mean, look at Godsend a few revisions back. It had about 11 images. At a high thumb size and a low screen res, it looked like total crap and was almost completely unreadable. Quotes and images are very much a good thing, but there is definitely such a thing as too much of a good thing.--Hardvice (talk) 14:35, 12 February 2007 (EST)
    • OMG, do we need to start a "Quotes, pt. 4"? ... I really agree that quotes should be used sparingly. I also think that our episode summaries, though fantastically written and full of great information, are sometimes difficult to navigate, simply because they're very long. I played with the idea of breaking them into acts (based on commercial breaks), but that was just not a good solution. Having a few quality, illustrative quotes sprinkled throughout might break up the page nicely. But I'm not sure that's a project I want to take on right away, or even if it has any support from the community. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 14:51, 12 February 2007 (EST)
      • I'm willing to entertain any suggestions that will help. I took a stab at creating a template for in-page quotes. Right now, they'll look like this.--Hardvice (talk) 15:21, 12 February 2007 (EST)


Every Episode Thus Far...

As best as I can tell, as of Distractions, there's only three major characters in the ensemble who have appeared in every episode thus far. That threesome is Claire, Mr. Bennet, and Hiro. Should there be some way of notating that in this thing, perhaps about the same place as where we notate which characters do not appear in a given episode? And if so, how would it be best included? -- ZachsMind 12:48, 8 February 2007 (EST)

  • Assuming it holds up for a while (and I'm guessing it will, at least until the next flashback episode where I could see either Claire or Hiro being absent), it seems like their individual character pages would be a better place than the individual episodes, but if we were to note it on the episode pages, then I'd say yes, alongside the non-appearances would be best. But on which episode do we start noting it? Who's the last major character to have a first non-appearance? (And when did Peter not appear?)--Hardvice (talk) 12:56, 8 February 2007 (EST)
    • It looks like 7MtM is both Peter's and Niki's first non-appearance, so maybe that's the best place to start noting it.--Hardvice (talk) 12:59, 8 February 2007 (EST)
  • Since it's a character-specific piece of trivia, I'd say it best fits on the trivia of each of those characters. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 13:03, 8 February 2007 (EST)
  • Another option I've been thinking about for a while is a list of character appearances by episode. It's a clunky, geeky, trivia-ish sort of article, but I think it would be fun in a Character connections sort of way, and this would be perfect trivia on that page, too.--Hardvice (talk) 13:02, 8 February 2007 (EST)
    • I really like the idea of a listing of characters by episode. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 13:04, 8 February 2007 (EST)
    • I agree with Ryan that this is best placed on the characters' trivia. Something like "As of Distractions, Claire is on of only three characters to appear in every episode." I don't see us needing a list per episode since we note series regulars that don't appear already, and you can scan for linked character names in the synopsis. As far listing episodes per character - we already have that in the character histories. I wouldn't mind seeing small episode numbers added to the ep name headers though so we can see if it skips one. --Fcphantom 13:38, 8 February 2007 (EST)
      • The Buffy geek in me recalls it being interesting that by the end of the fourth season there were only four characters who had never missed an episode, and by the start of the seventh season there were only two. Seems we've already narrowed the gap with this series and we haven't even hit the first season mark. I'm sorta hoping that when we get to Company Man, which deals with HRG, Claire will be a prominent part of both the past and future, since that's about when she was born, and Hiro will have his own separate plotline where, like with Charlie and Six Months Ago, he goes back in time fifteen years himself for some reason. So we'll continue seeing this threesome be THE ones never to miss an ep. =) -- ZachsMind 13:41, 8 February 2007 (EST)
        • Huge Buffy geek here! I keep wanting to add a Buffy reference page, but besides Leonard Roberts and Clea DuVall both having acted in B:tVS, I just can't come up with enough to justify it. :-( --Fcphantom 16:51, 9 February 2007 (EST)
          • Kring will probably never admit it, but Claire is so blatantly a fascimilie of Buffy Summers to me as to be almost plaigiaristic. However, Buffy had super strength and was able to withstand damage without much permanent effects, much like the other prominent female in the ensemble, Niki/Jessica. So Jess & Claire are practically Buffy cut in half, with shades of Wolverine and The Hulk scattered in for good measure. -- ZachsMind 14:35, 12 February 2007 (EST)