Episode talk:I Am Become Death

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Why No Fight?

Why didn't Sylar retaliate against Knox? He could have quite easily killed him. Or if he wish to remain passive, simply thrown him aside. --Rybo5000


Reference

The title might be a reference to Oppenheimer quoting the Bhagavad Gita when the first nuclear test "Trinity" was successful: "Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds." --Juba 09:22, 30 September 2008 (EDT)

  • What a GREAT title to this episode! Sylar represents Oppenheimer quoting it. Mohinder is Indian and becomes a deadly creature... the quote is from the Bhagavad Gita, an Indian Text. Peter "becomes Death" in a way by taking Sylar's power... Great! --Action Figure 10:36, 7 October 2008 (EDT)

Oh, my.

  • This episode so far is ridiculous. I love it. Niki, Barbara, and Tracy weren't born with abilities, but were given them. Tracy can reverse her freezing. Future Peter hints that Nathan, Claire, and Mohinder (well, obviously Mohinder) were also not born with abilities. Present Peter knocks the Haitian the hell out. Claire is a villain working with Knox and Daphne; Peter seemingly copied Flint's blue flames... and Sylar has turned around entirely, and this is only in the first twenty minutes.--Riddler 21:23, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
  • I just shouted... DAMN.--Riddler 21:33, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
    • The preview for next episode made me say that :O - Cael 22:03, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
    • That explosion blew me away. No pun intended. I mean, seriously. I swear to God, my heart stopped for a second there. That was probably one of the most exciting moments in all of Heroes. And I think this has been the best episode so far. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 22:10, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
      • Incredible episode. I missed the preview for the next one, though... the explosion (the reason FOR the explosion) made me sad... JackOfBloodyHearts 22:14, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
        • I can't believe they killed a kid on TV. You can't do that! :O--Riddler 22:14, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
          • I think this is my favorite episode thus far this season...very nicely choreographed. I also liked Nathan saving Tracy's life.--MiamiVolts (talk) 00:47, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Y'know, I'm not so sure Claire and the others are the villains in this situation. I mean, just look at Daphne... Then again, I don't think FP was either. Perhaps each side thinks they're doing good... but of course the other side thinks the other is doing bad... Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 22:25, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
    • That's what the premise was behind Magneto, Stan Lee wanted a villain who truly thought what he was doing was for the better. Dracomaster4 22:35, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
  • I have a problem with the morgue scene with the two peters. When the Hatian leaves, why doesn't Scarred Peter pop the bullets out and regenerate? We've seen that he can be dead for a while and then come back, and also that he is unable to die if he has Claire's power. Once Past Peter is able to use his powers again, Scar Peter should be able to also.
    • Scarred Peter is unconscious. In S1, it worked cause his body passively absorbed Claire's ability. In this example, Claire wasn't around without the presence of the Haitian, so future Peter's body couldn't do that. In addition, I wouldn't be surprised if Claire took additional measures once she secured future Peter's body.--MiamiVolts (talk) 00:43, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
      • "Peter is dead." - Present Peter. --Riddler 13:36, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
    • Given future Peter's scar, I think it's safe to say that something happened to him that made him lose his regeneration ability. Or maybe there are just some things that can't be recovered from. --Psiphiorg 15:53, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
      • I'm pretty sure future Peter is dead. Claire said that she could kill present-day Peter with a bullet to the base of the head (which we've already established in the Heroes universe), and so she probably shot future Peter in the base of the head. My only beef with this is that all of the wounds I saw in future Peter were in his chest... Claire was facing future Peter when he shot him. I don't understand how she got to the back of the head, thus I don't understand how future Peter is dead. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 20:39, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
        • Perhaps we're supposed to believe she knocked him out with the bullets to the chest then executioner'd him between the alley and the morgue --Matchu 05:48, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
    • Personally I think that this was the best episode this season, but I also think this is the worse season in the series. --Pinkkeith 12:22, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
      • I absolutely loved it! Might be the best episode so far, and S.3 might very well become the best season. It's ridiculous and camp, sure, but in the best possible way. :D Pierre 18:12, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
        • Pinkkeith, you nuts? So far this season, I think, is incredible. Season two was below par, Season One was great, and this is off to a great start.--Riddler 19:36, 8 October 2008 (EDT)

Exposed or villains... we should decide before making changes

  • Before we make the mass changes necessary, we should decide where to do them. I was under the impression this was the exposed future, not the villains one... Stevehim 22:12, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
    • Aren't they one and the same? That's what FP said, he tried to change it, but it didn't change 'cause someone is still putting the formula together in present time... JackOfBloodyHearts 22:14, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
      • Yeah, I think we should "merge" those two futures and all references to them. Technically, there were three explosion futures that were shown centering around the destruction of New York in November 2006. Now there are at least two exposed futures centering on the revelation and development of superpowers.--Tim Thomason 22:17, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
        • I agree. I posed this to a patroller yesterday (see Ryan's talk page), but now we kinda need to decide, as the changes are going to span upwards of 20 pages. Stevehim 22:18, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
        • Wasn't the future Hiro traveled to really the only "Villains" future? And since we don't yet know if that was a true Villains future or just the exposed future, we can't say for sure. It could even possibly the same thing, since the future that Hiro sees seems to take place before the future we see in this episode. But for the future we saw in this episode... I'm pretty sure this is the exposed future, which in turn caused the rise of many new villains. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 23:02, 6 October 2008 (EDT)
          • Wasn't the exposed future only caused by Nathan revealing he had powers. Since that didn't happen, isn't this one a different one (unless Peter can teleport to alternate realities). I remember on another show that it's still an alternate reality even if there are minor differences. I think that this is a different future than the one Future Peter came from even though they're similar. --Dman dustin 06:17, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
            • I agree, I think. In the old future, evolved humans were persecuted... now in this one, evolved humans are everywhere. I think it's an entirely different future that centers around Mohinder's serum and the Company formula... but then which future is future Peter from? Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 08:04, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
            • Yeah to me it seems different from the exposed future. It seems to be basically the same one as the villains future although 'villains future' probably isn't a good name. I would call it something like the formula future or abilities future. But I don't see it as the exposed future as they were never exposed and persecuted. Instead people were just given abilities through the formula. The Shadow 15:43, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
              • The future seen in this episode is the Villains future. It should not be merged with the Exposed future since its very different from Peter's original timeline. Sure, the formula was leaked in both futures, but it's not the same one.--Citizen 17:48, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
                • Huh? It is the same formula. Mohinder said his formula didn't work.--MiamiVolts (talk) 17:50, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
        • I still say it's the same future, but it has changed, due to Peter's actions. There were lots of changes made in the season 1 future, but we only have one (explosion) for it. Once a future ceases to exist (like the one from The Second Coming), it should probably, IMO, be merged with the new future by making notes on the page. Plus, as it stands right now, we're missing a bunch of stuff for the villains future, since it lists Angela's dream as being part of it, but has none of the requisite character pages to go along with it. Stevehim 07:14, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
          • I say its the Villains future, as Nathan is president and married to Tracy Strauss. This never happened in the original future and I don't think they should be merged.--Citizen 13:54, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
            • How do we know that? AFAIK, we were never told who was president or anything about Tracy or Nathan in the 'original' exposed future. The main points on why I think it should be merged:
              1. It's been confirmed to be the same future by the writers.
              2. We don't have a split for every change that occurred in the first season future.
              3. Splitting it causes logistical problems...Do we make separate pages for all of the people in Angela's dream, since, as it stands right now, they were in the villains future? How do we deal with Hiro, who was killed both by Ando and by a sword in the chest? Both events are currently listed in the villains future. Stevehim 14:11, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
              • Peter told Nathan he never became a senator in his future, let alone a president. When the writers said they were the same future, they must have meant the same disaster, which was the formula getting out and people having abilities. The explosion happened in 3 different timelines, but they weren't all the same future, which makes most of the future articles of season 1 wrong, seeing as we knew 3 future Peters and 2 future Hiros.--Citizen 15:19, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
                • I think what the writers meant (and what the case is, IMO) is that it's the same future, but it keep changing, due to changes being made in the past. The same thing with season 1. We're talking about possible futures (as there is only one 'real' future for all of the seasons combined), but to have pages for every possibility that blinks in and out of existence is far too cumbersome to maintain. We should just have pages for the main ones (ie - the ones that have a sufficient amount of scenes to warrant it). Right now, having a page and calling it a future for 2 short scenes (Angela's dream and Hiro's trip) seems silly...especially when we don't have any evidence at all that those two scenes are even connected (ie - part of the same future). Stevehim 15:54, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
        • Well, I'm sure this is the SAME future Future Peter is from. If it was a different future, we should see another Peter from that future, right? But Claire and the others refer to him as THE Peter and present time's Peter is "the Peter from the Past" and that's it. So they (Claire and the others) know there is a Peter in their timeline, if Future Peter was from another timeline we would have 3 Peters (present Peter, that timeline's Peter and the Peter from the other timeline's future) or at least we should read or be told that the Peter from that timeline died or is hidden or something... but Claire and the others assume he is the same they know, so... he is the same. (The only possible exception being this: That timeline's future Peter just dissapeared (by art of magic) and at the same time the Future Peter we know entered that timeline line replacing him, so nobody noticed the change.. absurd). Anyway, I agree every single change in a timeline creates a new future... I believe a person cannot go back to the same future he departed from, it won't be the same future at all, specially when big changes were made... but anyway, who knows for sure?
  • There's a consensus check going on here on whether the pages should be merged or not, and a general idea of what a merged page might look like here. Please vote and/or make suggestions on this..if we do combine them, we should probably try to do so before Monday's episode, toavoid confusion about where to put the new info. Stevehim 08:12, 10 October 2008 (EDT)

New actors and characters

          
          

Still need a bunch of pictures...more to come later! -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 23:10, 6 October 2008 (EDT)

  • I think Katherine Kirkpatrick also goes by the names Sage Kirkpatrick, Laura Palmer, Ravanelle Richardson and Ravenelle Richardson (I found her imdb profile in a Google search). There's a lot of, um, indecent photos of her so be prepared to see some if you do a search for a better photo than this one.--MiamiVolts (talk) 00:05, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
  • I also checked for Thomas Robinson, but I think he's very new. I can't find any profiles for him, and I think the IMDb one has his Heroes credit mixed up with another actor's profile. I doubt he played a Hospital Police Officer in a 2001 film. ;)--MiamiVolts (talk) 00:16, 8 October 2008 (EDT)

Link The German, Dr. Zimmerman and Barbara together? OK!

  • [1] --Action Figure
    • Wow, what a catch. We can't be sure if that's Niki or Barbara though, albeit Barbara being the more likely.--Riddler 00:01, 7 October 2008 (EDT)

...Summary?

Looks like we've got another One of Us, One of Them on our hands... Seriously, who's writing these anachronistic summaries? Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 08:02, 7 October 2008 (EDT)

  • Better?--Riddler 21:02, 7 October 2008 (EDT)

Images

I'm working on capturing some images from I Am Become Death right now. If there are any requests, let me know. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 17:55, 7 October 2008 (EDT)

  • If it's not too dark, I would prefer future Mohinder's picture in the hooded cloak for the Episode screenshot as I noted in Heroes Wiki:Requested Screen Captures. I like that analogy for Death better than the exploding Sylar.--MiamiVolts (talk) 20:47, 7 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Can you please capture an image of the cockroach that is seen walking over Mohinder's voice recorder, when we visit Mohinder's lab in the exposed future.--Rvsdl 01:47, 9 October 2008 (EDT)

Nathan love machine?

Sorry if this isn't allowed here, i'm first time editor, but anyone else get the feeling Nathan is going for the hat trick?

  • I think that will depend on how much influence 'Linderman' has on Nathan, and whether 'Barbara' is alive and not openly psychotic. --Metaphysician 13:29, 9 October 2008 (EDT)

How they got away

I was watching the explosion scene again, and if you look really closely (just after you see the 'bubble' encompass the fire), it looks like a black 'dart' shoots out toward the upper left part of the screen. I think Peter may have flown away (even though the events in the house don't really support that). Can anyone confirm (or deny) this, or maybe even get a screencap of it? Stevehim 21:26, 8 October 2008 (EDT)

That could also be Daphne, running away at full speed. Peter technically didn't have to fly away, he and Claire (and Sylar, for that matter) could just regenerate afterwards. --Maelwys 21:29, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
  • It couldn't be Daphne, as it was well into the sky. Their ability to regenerate is unclear. We have too many conflicting sources, and the explosion only makes matters worse. In Season 2, Adam, Victoria and Angela all indicate that Adam can be permanently killed by a shot to the head (though Angela's comment is slightly less definitive). And yet we have HRG coming back from a bullet to the head, and Claire and Peter both coming back once the shard and stick were removed from their respective brains. This season, we have Sylar saying (twice) that Claire can't be killed, Angela saying that Sylar can't be killed, and Future Knox saying that Future Claire can't die. And then we have Claire saying a bullet to the back of the head will 'do the job.' Then we have the writers saying Sylar was just messing with Claire, and that she, and everyone else, can indeed be killed, and decpaitation is a good way to do it; and we have Angela's dream seeming to back this up. Of course, being at ground zero of a nuclear-type explosion is a good way to ensure decapitation...and everything else-itation, so it only adds to the inconsistency of regeneration that they've set up (I was willing to accept the S1 arguments that Peter didn't actually explode, but projected the blast outwards, but that wouldn't apply here). And on top of all that, we have Future Peter dying when his powers were suppressed, and then not regenerating afterwards. Stevehim 22:11, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
    • This previous note is in the wrong place. But Peter has survived an explosion over New York after he absorbed regeneration from Claire, and Sylar (in a possible future from Season One) survived an explosion after he gained regeneration from Claire. So it's not speculative to say that Sylar, Claire and Peter all survived this one. It would explain how Peter and Claire are alive, but not necessarily how Peter was incapacitated afterwards. --Bob (talk) 23:45, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
      • But it directly contradicts what we've been told in the show (and in the BTE), is all I meant. Stevehim 08:49, 9 October 2008 (EDT)
        • Regeneration and space-time manipulation, and even induced radioactivity suffer from a lack of consistency; for instance the claim that Peter needed Claire's power to survive the explosion but then a CBR interview states that people can't generally be hurt by their own power. I guess the writers just make it up as they go along, depending on the plot. Photolysis 09:07, 9 October 2008 (EDT)
          • Easiest explanation: a mix of lies and incomplete knowledge. We've only ever been *told* that brain damage could kill a regenerator permanently, and never by a 100% unbiased source. Whereas we've had, by comparison, outright cases of brain damage occuring, and death only lasting insofar as something physical is inside the brain to obstruct growth. That said, its not like 'go for the brain' is bad tactics when fighting a regenerator; its the easiest way to incapacitate one, after all. --Metaphysician 10:43, 9 October 2008 (EDT)
        • For fatal deaths tied to regeneration its been stated that bullets to the BASE of the skull could ideally kill someone like that glass shard and the stick, both in Season 1, but when removed they lived again. A bullet would be quite hard to remove if it fragmented. Plus in Season 3 we saw Knox decapitate Claire in that dream and that quite possibly actually killed her. But lets not forget Claire survived Ted exploding in her Odessa housse, at point blank range. If I had to guess I'd say the explosion didn't damage Claire and possibly Peter enough to destroy the fabled base of the skull region. --PeterDawson 10:54, 10 October 2008 (EDT)
        • When Claire said a bullet to the back of the head should "do the job" maybe she meant that as a way to subdue and incapicitate Peter. Just as in the case when Claire had the stick in her head and when Peter had the glass shard in his head (Season 1). I would imagine these items would need to be removed by someone else before the healing begins (without the presence of the Haitian nearby of course). A bullet to the base of the brain would be difficult to remove especially if fragmented. This does present a question: Sylar was able to push out the bullets after Noah shot him in the level 5 facility. Why wasn't F-Peter able to do this after F-Claire shot him? I know the Haitian was nearby, but P-Peter presumably knocked him out during his escape. Why couldn't F-Peter push out these bullets when the Haitian was on the ground? In the event that the Haitian was still conscious, even in the "interrogation/torture" room after P-Peter was untied by Nathan, he was able to use his powers. Why couldn't F-Peter be saved while the Haitian was not around? On another topic, Why didn't P-Peter and F-Gabriel stop time or use telekinesis during the fight with F-Daphne/Knox/Claire? --Denali 13:46, 10 October 2008 (EDT)

Peter's "hunger"?

After reading the "Theories:Waffles" page, I've decided this is website is an open forum for discussion. Why would Peter have the "hunger" to find out how people work when he already has empathic mimicry? He can ALREADY obtain other people's powers without slicing and dicing them...kind of redundant, no? Plus Peter can already fly! But I remember the dialogue was something like "Your thought processes, your emotions"...perhaps intuitive aptitude sees more than just what their power is?? Terrifried 05:33, 9 October 2008 (EDT)

  • The reason he attacked his bro was to find out why he's going what hes doing.--Skywalkerrbf 05:57, 9 October 2008 (EDT)
    • As far as I've understood "the Hunger" isn't as much a need to get abilities, but rather a need to understand the function of the abilities. Pierre 08:52, 9 October 2008 (EDT)
      • I think "the hunger" is the drive to always want to understand something to the fullest. After F-Nathan untied P-Peter, he told him to read his mind to understand. After P-Peter read his mind, he wasn't satisfied and wanted a more clear understanding of why his future brother thinks it's the right thing to do. In this instance, he wasn't hungry for any ability, he was hungry for a better understanding on why Nathan thought the way he did. I think once he realized what he did, he figured out this is what led Sylar to become a serial killer. That's why when P-Peter teleported back to Sylar's level 5 cell, P-Peter told Sylar (something to this effect) he saw what happens with his ability and thats why he wouldn't become like another Sylar. -Denali 11:10, 10 October 2008
  • Future Gabriel (I Am Become Death): "My name is Gabriel, and you don't realize...my ability is not just understanding how things work; there's a hunger that comes with it...to know more..to have more. I couldn't control it, and it turned me into a killer. A monster. Stevehim 11:26, 10 October 2008 (EDT)

Mr. Muggles

Why isn't Mr. Muggles listed as a character here? Noah says his name when they prepare for breakfast (at 16:50 or so)? --BloodyFox 08:35, 13. Oct. 2008 (CEST)

  • I believe it requires an actual appearance on screen. --Matchu 02:38, 13 October 2008 (EDT)
    • Ehrm... yes. He did appear, Gabriel even fed him :> --BloodyFox 12:28, 13. Oct. 2008 (CEST)

Is this the same future?

I am kind of confused. Is this the same future that Future Peter came from because in that one they say evolved humans are being captured. But when Future Peter and Present Peter go to the future there are people with abilities on the streets in the open.--Scorvi12 (talk) 02:48, 3 January 2009 (EST)

Maybe only the "terrorist" ones are being rounded up and experimented one. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 10:25, 3 January 2009 (EST)
It's not the same future. Future Peter changed the future to one where everyone gets abilities when he came back in time and shot his brother at the press conference.--MiamiVolts (talk) 10:48, 3 January 2009 (EST)
It's a bit of a paradox, really.--IotV
Not really a paradox, but it would make more sense for it to be the reverse if we didn't know the circumstances.--MiamiVolts (talk) 10:58, 3 January 2009 (EST)

Image

Why Sylar exploding? it wasn't really what the episode was about, why not a image where future peter is death? -- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 11:37, 9 December 2009 (EST)

  • Well, the Grim Reaper is also known as the bringer of death. Sylar's exploding brings death to over 200 000 people, so I think it is fitting. --mc_hammark 11:40, 9 December 2009 (EST)
    • The quote that the phrase "I am become Death" comes from is about having created a monster, something evil that cannot be unmade (In the quote's case, the atomic bomb. In our case, giving Peter the Hunger, I think.) --Ricard Desi (t,c) 12:07, 9 December 2009 (EST)
      • I thought that i am become death meant that past Peter is a live in the Future and Future Peter has died in his own time. Thats why i thought about a image of dead future peter (or Peter and Future peter together with future Peter dead)-- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 12:10, 9 December 2009 (EST)
        • Well the thing about the titles is that the thing they are about, is usually about multiple of the characters. I mean, it could reference to peter's death, sylar's explosion, mohinder's becoming a monster or even peter getting the hunger. The titles are meant to be ambiguous most of the time. --mc_hammark 13:49, 9 December 2009 (EST)
          • Yeah i know, but i'm just thinking that it's especially about Future Peter's death.-- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 13:53, 9 December 2009 (EST)
            • To me, exploding Sylar seems screaming "I AM BECOME DEEEEEEATH!!!" :) let it remain as it is. Green.gif AltesUTC CH