Talk:Portal:Evolutions Characters

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Categorization

Donahue and Perez. I still think they belong here and not in the GN portal. I'm afraid of messing up the formatting. Therequiembellishere 16:25, 11 September 2008 (EDT)

  • It's a judgment call and I have mixed feelings. Initially, I thought they should be moved to the GN portal...but then I thought, what if Bridget Bailey made a brief appearance, just as Donahue did. She would certainly not be considered a graphic novel character. On the other hand, I'm thinking about Brian, who had an entire graphic novel dedicated to him which he narrated and the story revolved around him, yet he's still over in the HE portal, and maybe he's better off in a GN portal too. I'm going back and forth. Ultimately, as long as they're in a portal, that's all that matters, and as long as we're consistent, that's the next thing that matters. I could be more assertive with an opinion, but I just don't think it matters too much one way or another, so long as we're consistent (which we're not right now). -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 18:00, 11 September 2008 (EDT)
    • What is to stop a character from being in both the graphic novel and the evolutions portal? I mean, they're in both, so why not? --DocM 18:13, 11 September 2008 (EDT)
      • Well, that's one thing we definitely don't want. If we did that, it would mean they would have multiple navbars on their page, and that's never a good idea. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 18:22, 11 September 2008 (EDT)
        • I think it should come down to where the character has had more activity. For Donahue and Perez, that is undeniably within Evolutions. Brian I'm not so sure. I forget what he did in Evolutions. Therequiembellishere 15:41, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
          • I don't think it should have to do with where there's more activity, otherwise Richard Drucker and Connie probably wouldn't be graphic novel characters, and Hana Gitelman wouldn't be considered an episodic character. I think it needs to be a hierarchical thing, like episodes above webisodes (that goes without saying), webisodes above graphic novels, and graphic novels above Evolutions content. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 16:19, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
            • Yeah - hierarchy would be the way to go, and RGS's suggestion sounds just about right to me (and it is the way it currently works, in most cases). The only problem for me is when characters appear in person, played by an actor, in Evolutions, and then makes minor GN appearances (yeah, I'm talking about Brian, Walter and Kelly). When an actor is hired to play the part, it doesn't seem right to regard him/her a graphic novel character... Pierre 17:57, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
              • This is sounding dumb as I type, but how a bout aportal for characters who cross portals? Therequiembellishere 18:12, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
                • It doesn't sound dumb, but I don't think it's the best idea. In that case, we'd be categorizing characters more by where they've been on Heroes Wiki than by appearances in Heroes content. What if the hierarchy looked like this: episodic characters → webisodic characters → live HE characters → GN characters → other HE characters? (Does that make any sense at all?) -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 18:21, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
                  • It does to me. However, I think that since the GNs are a more established media than the Webisodes, it should go: episodic characters → GN characters → webisodic characters → live HE characters → other HE characters. --SacValleyDweller (talk) 21:11, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
                    • Wouldn't that kind of defeat the point of the whole "when an actor is hired to play the part, it doesn't seem right to regard him/her a graphic novel character" concept? -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 21:19, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
                      • I overlooked that part of the conversation. I'm in the camp of "whatever media a character is most important to in the plot is where the character should be placed." Brian should be in the evolutions portal, and have only the evolutions navbar in his article. However, a link to him in the GN space (with his GN pic) is perfectly acceptable. Now with Hana, here is what think for her: We link to her from Eps, GN and Evolutions portals. Since she is important in both Evolutions and GNs, we make a special navbar that is cut in half with Hana related GN characters on top, and Evolutions characters on the bottom. Characters in similar situations, we deal with in on a case by case basis. If they are important in more than one place, we make navbars similar to the proposed Hana navbar. --SacValleyDweller (talk) 22:28, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
                        • Oy, that does not sound too appealing to me, and certainly takes out the ease of navigating that navbars and portals are supposed to provide. Plus, when we start assigning based on "importance" in a certain area, we get very subjective and we cross into a very gray area. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 23:39, 12 September 2008 (EDT)
                          • RGS's suggestion for a hierarchy (episodic characters → webisodic characters → live HE characters → GN characters → other HE characters) would be the ideal as far as I'm concerned. If I'm not mistaken, this is also the way the characters are categorized today.
                          • And just like RGS I, don't think double categorization or double portal linking is such a good idea. It will become more difficult to maintain, and will most certainly open up for several new possibilities of long arguments, which is something we don't need. :) Pierre 07:45, 13 September 2008 (EDT)
                            • The way I would see it then, basically we would have two tiers: first we would put all characters who are portrayed by live actors into the portal where the live actor appeared, with the episodes being first, then the webisodes, then HE content. Then we would characters that appear in GNs but don't have live actors in the GN portals, and all HE characters in their proper spots.

                              Some examples to illustrate: Hana would be an episodic character since she appeared in an episode. Echo would be a webisodic character since the live actor appeared in an webisode (that is, until he appears in an episode, even for a moment). Brian would be an HE character because it's the highest tier the actor appeared in. GN characters would include Agent Perez and Donahue. Somebody like Liza Messer would be an HE character because she hasn't appeared anywhere else.

                              What remains is what to do with people who are mentioned, but don't appear. For instance, Drucker, who has appeared in the GNs, but a live actor was cast to play his voice in a recording. Before there was a picture of the guy, Arthur Petrelli had appeared in a huge GN arc, but was pretty heavily mentioned in the episodes, though he never appeared--he was considered an episodic character, and I personally agree. What would happen if Mr. Ellis, who appeared in 2 GNs, were mentioned on the show? Personally, I think he should remain a GN character, depending on the reference in the show. What if Lukas Bahn was mentioned heavily in the GNs, but never appeared? Again, depending on the reference, he could be a GN character. I think ultimately, with characters who are mentioned and referenced, it's a judgment call.

                              I'm now officially labeling myself a nerd because I can't believe I'm involving myself so heavily in such a trivial topic. :) -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 11:28, 13 September 2008 (EDT)

                              • IMO, a mentioning/reference/minor voice appearance rarely should change the categorization of a character. The only exceptions I can think of is characters who has been mentioned heavily in the proper show, and made minor appearances in another media (this due to the fact that the show is the main area of the Heroes universe). Since these cases are very rare, I'd say it can be decided from case to case.

                                And it's cool to be a nerd B) /Pierre 14:33, 13 September 2008 (EDT)

So... can we agree on the following hierarchy: episodic characters → webisodic characters → live HE characters → GN characters → other HE characters. Visual appearances always triumphs mentions/referrences/minor voice appearances, with the only possible exception being characters with a remarkable amount of references on the main show. It would be really good to have this agreed on prior to the season premiere. :) /Pierre 08:00, 14 September 2008 (EDT)

  • Agreed. Therequiembellishere 11:38, 14 September 2008 (EDT)
    • Following this rules, Ryan, Harding and Shell are to be moved to the Evs Dropper-related GN characters page, right? Pierre 06:56, 16 September 2008 (EDT)
      • Well, I certainly wouldn't call them "rules"--maybe just good guidelines to follow. But yes, if they appeared in a graphic novel, the argument would be made that they should probably be moved to a graphic novel character portal. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 07:02, 16 September 2008 (EDT)
        • Yeah, guidelines is a better word, but you get my point :) Anyhow, I've moved them. Pierre 07:38, 16 September 2008 (EDT)

Artist

Anyone know who's drawing the portraits for all of these new evolutions characters from iStory and Primatech map? --SacValleyDweller (talk) 02:25, 22 November 2008 (EST)

  • No clue. I've asked CBR's behind the eclipse and Ryan's tried to ask Joe Tolerico, but we've gotten no answer so far.--MiamiVolts (talk) 02:30, 22 November 2008 (EST)
    • They're cool, though, aren't they? Very different. I can pretty safely assume it's not any of our current GN artists. I'm hoping Joe gets back to me soon, but who knows? -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 11:02, 22 November 2008 (EST)