View source for Episode talk:An Invisible Thread

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===Character Updates===
Update Main Character pages  <br />
_x_ [[Peter]] <br />
_x_ [[Nathan]] <br />
_x_ [[Claire]] <br />
_x_ [[Matt]]  <br />
_x_ [[Hiro]]<br />
_x_ [[Mohinder]] <br />
_x_ [[Noah]] <br />
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N/A [[Maya]]<br />
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_x_ [[Lyle Bennet]]<br />
_x_ [[Sandra Bennet]]<br />
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_x_ [[Michael Dorn]] <br />
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_x_ [[Death]] <br />
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<small>''Note: if an "examples" page exists, that's where examples should be added.''</small><br />
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_x_ [[telepathy]]<br />
_x_ [[Space-time manipulation]]<br />
_x_ [[Ability supercharging]]<br />
_x_ [[telekinesis]]<br />
_X_ [[intuitive aptitude]]<br />
_x_ [[ability replication]]<br />
_x_ [[rapid cell regeneration]]<br />
_x_ [[flight]]<br />
_x_ [[freezing]]<br />
_x_ [[Clairsentience]]<br />
_x_ [[Electric manipulation]]<br />
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===Miscellaneous Updates===
[[:Category:Events|Events]]/[[:Category:Items|Items]]/[[:Category:Things|Things]]/etc. <br />
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_x_ [[Claire's heart necklace]] <br />
_x_ [[Sylar's funeral]]<br />
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___ [[Washington, DC]]<br />
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_x_ [[Nathan's Senate office]]<br />
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_x_ [[Claire's heart necklace]]<br />

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New places (450x350)<br />
_x_ [[Stanton Hotel]]<br />
_x_ [[Nathan's suite]]<br />

All powers used (450x350)<br />
_x_ [[shape shifting]]<br />
_x_ [[telepathy]]<br />
_x_ [[Space-time manipulation]]<br />
_x_ [[Ability supercharging]]<br />
_x_ [[telekinesis]]<br />
_x_ [[intuitive aptitude]]<br />
_X_ [[ability replication]]<br />
_X_ [[rapid cell regeneration]]<br />
_x_ [[flight]]<br />
_x_ [[freezing]]<br />
_x_ [[Water mimicry]]<br />
_x_ [[Clairsentience]]<br />
_x_ [[Electric manipulation]]<br />

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==Airing==
This airs on my birthday. I'll be busy that night. =[--[[User:Riddler|Riddler]] 16:32, 30 March 2009 (EDT)
*Well children, the solution is quite simple.  

Invent a device capable of transporting you to a dimension where the events in the 'Heroes' universe take place, ideally at a point where you have direct access to a sample of the genetic modification formula.  Then comes the hard part: you must be lucky enough to have the right DNA combination to receive space-time manipulation. 

Then its just a matter of going back to your native dimension, traveling to the moment your parents were 'engaging' and hold it off for a little while.  Good luck - [[User:Barbedknives|Barbedknives]] 22:46, 23 April 2009 (EDT)

** Or get a VCR and record it. --{{User:Ice Vision/sig}} 00:08, 27 April 2009 (EDT)

Or, instead of getting the formula, you could just wait until this episode happens. Or, as Ice Vision said, just get a VCR.--[[User:ERROR|ERROR]] 14:43, 11 June 2009 (EDT)
* The episode already aired, and that doesn't stop him from being busy that night. - [[User:Josh|Josh]] ([[User talk:Josh|talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Josh|contribs]]) 15:22, 11 June 2009 (EDT)

== NOOOOOOOOOOOOO ==

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 21:39, 27 April 2009 (EDT)

*[[User:IceGhost78|IceGhost78]] oh my jewsus
*What!!!!!!!!!!! --[[User:BoomerDay|BoomerDay]] 21:40, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*Claire is gonna be so mad at him. :X [[User:Deathwish|Deathwish]] 21:41, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*Sylar really needs to die --[[User:BoomerDay|BoomerDay]] 21:43, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*what happened? -- Signyour Poste
**Nathan bought Claire a cake but he dropped it Chevy Chase style. [[User:Deathwish|Deathwish]] 21:46, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*Can't they just give Nathan some Claire's blood. His injuries look about the same as Noah's. --[[User:Reflections|Reflections]] 21:48, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*what nathan really died<br />
nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo<br />
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo<br />
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo<br />
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo<br />
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡<br />
¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡<br />
¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡<br />
¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡<br />
¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡ he was my favorite chartacter<br />

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO MYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY<br />
GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<br />
<br />
I KNOW, I MEAN WHAT IS UP WITH CHUCK BECOMING AN UPDATED INTERSECT?????<br />
I MEAN GEEZ!oh, and heroes was good to.--[[User:Autobot2|Hawkeye]] 12:59, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* I THINK I KNOW, they could maybe come up with a way that claire could find out were nathens bodie is and she could heal, were as sylar starts to remember his past.And for hiro, mohinder is right but his change in personality may have triggered it, he accepted that he is not the only super man, and he even said that "payback is a &!+(#", dont worry, nathen will somehow come back, I know it. visit my disscus page for more.--[[User:Autobot2|Hawkeye]] 12:59, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

== Whichever moron...==
...wasted the budget on seeing tracy transform from water to her human form should be fired! 

for anyone who actually watched the promo for this episode they were probably looking forward to seeing a big fight between Sylar Nathan and Peter but no instead we get to HEAR the fight and see Claire's stupid face being terrified. This wouldn't have pissed me off so much if they hadn't have done the same thing in 15 years gone! Sylar vs Peter? NO we get the other side of the freaking door! Whoever coins what the special fx budget for this show should really leave a side budget for season finale so we can SEE a decent fight! -- Signyour Poste
*I disagree, not showing it leaves the imagination to roam, this show shouldn't be all special effects and in-depth super fights. Most people don't recognize that his is what the so called major problem with season 2 compared to season 1. Look at the abilities displayed in season one and how they could be created (like telepathy only required an off-focus shaky camera and zooming on Matt's face). I'm not saying all of the powers were easily created as that one, but that's where season 2 differs, every other scene was with some flashy effect and some viewers didn't enjoy this as they felt the writers got too cocky with the effects and forgot to tell a story. Although I sincerely enjoyed both (and all) seasons and watched them religiously, I can see where the fandom of Heroes can be separated; the people who watch just for cool effects and the people that watch for a story. -- Signyour Commente
**...and I think you are referring to [[Five Years Gone]]--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 21:02, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
***I am a huge fan so I can only hope that they did that so that the fight could appear in next seasons prologue episode to show that Nathan some how survived and I have idea for Nathan surviving on talk page in my portal.[[User:Autobot2|Hawkeye]] 12:50, April 30 2009
****2 or 3 total C.G.I fights wouldn't hurt, but I think there are some fans out there that want those all out balls-to-the-walls super heroic total CGI fight scenes every other episode...and in my opinion, that would partially take away from Heroes--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 00:15, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
*****I think we really only needed one good cgi fight scene. I'm thinking a clean shot of Peter/Nathan getting electrocuted or shrapnel thrown at them, then cutting to a shot of Nathan flying with Sylar slamming him into the sides of buildings outside before being overcome and thrown back into the room.  Would have been cool. -{{user:barbedknives/sig}}00:21, 1 May 2009 (EDT)

I agree, actually.--[[User:ERROR|ERROR]] 14:50, 11 June 2009 (EDT)

== Did anyone else notice the MAJOR plot holes? ==

1) they could have used Claire's blood to save Nathan as they CLEARLY did before in season 2 when Noah was killed.
2) Even if they couldnt do that Peter just took SHAPESHIFTING powers! i'm sure since Nathan is his brother he could pretend to be him for a short amount of time and i dont know somehow fake Nathan's death or come up withan exscuse. 
3) I seriously doubt after after EVERYTHING Sylar has done Noah would let him live he'd slice of his head before Angela even shouted NOOO!!!!!
Either the heroes writter have never heard of the word continuity or they've designed there characters to be complete retards and assume the fans are dumbasss

I have possable explanation.[[User:Autobot2|Hawkeye]] 12:52, 30 April 2009 (EDT)

:I also have a '''possible''' explanation: Volume Four was written to be a new start for the writers, fans, and characters. Essentially, they wanted Fugitives to be a spot where a new fan could jump in, knowing nothing about the characters or their pasts, and still know what they needed to know. Them using Claire's blood would render this attempt useless, since it'd leave tons of new fans asking "WTF Claire's blood can heal?" and probably old fans pissed at how the writers would likely have to present this fact: "Hey Noah, can't your daughter's blood heal?" "Oh yeah! [calls Claire]" Basically this volume was meant to erase the bad writing of the past and make something fresh. Claire's blood would weigh it down. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 19:53, 2 May 2009 (EDT)

*To kill off a major character in a show is seen as a big decision because normally characters can't come back to life. To use claire's blood to bring back every main character is just a way of avoiding big decisions and preventing the show from moving forwards. Every once in a while a main character MUST die or else the fans will start to think "oh (main character) has just died....it doesn't matter he/she will just get brought back to life". 

Even though peter could imitate Nathan, after that he would be gone, Angela wanted at least a bit of Nathan to still be around even if it is Sylar deep down.--[[User:Cazza09|Cazza09]] 11:27, 12 May 2009 (EDT)

** Assuming he is one of the smartest characters, Noah Bennet can never be this dull(not considering the moment he traded the hostages, Claire/Elle, in season two.) We all know he knew Claire's blood(and possibly Sylar's) can heal a dead man(if the body is still in one piece and fresh) Noah was shot right through his eye into his brain, Mohinder waited for quite some time until he injected Claire's blood to revive Noah. Nathan just died due to blood loss no longer than an hour ago. The damage was nothing comparing to a bullet through a brain.

*** Suppose this were what the writer really considered(about wanting to fix bad writings of the past, letting new fans understand the episode), it is strictly his responsibility not to create a HUGE plot hole. All the above reasons are about how ''the writer'' should write, not how the story should proceed. A good writer would think of something to explain every decision. Perhaps, and only perhaps....if Noah were not there everything might have made sense.

== Go Pete! ==

Boyashaka!--{{User:Baldbobbo/sig}} 21:48, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*I never caught the explanation behind that syringe. The stuff in it kills, right? AND HE SHOULD STAY DEAD THANKS {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 21:48, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
:* No, it's an uber-high-strength tranquilizer. Danko said it'd "knock an elephant out." [[User:Hyperdude|Mike]] 22:21, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
:**Never mind then. So Danko isn't dead either? {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 22:22, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
:***I'd say no. Hiro just knocked him out cold. [[User:Hyperdude|Mike]] 22:24, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
:****about elephant thing, that refferenced alot in the show, Tazer for nikki in season 1, elephant man in villans, mohinders test subject thats all i remember, only see shows once. One of the writers favorite animals? Also excuse grammer small time to edit.--[[User:Autobot2|Hawkeye]] 12:57, 30 April 2009 (EDT)

Actually, Hawkeye, that was handcuffs, not a taser (Though there might have been a taser at some point...). And the writers probably use the word "elephant" a lot because they're tough (Or at least, made out to be...). But, you never know. Maybe you're right.--[[User:ERROR|ERROR]] 14:56, 11 June 2009 (EDT)

== She's baaaaaaaack ==

yep. --[[User:BoomerDay|BoomerDay]] 22:01, 27 April 2009 (EDT)

took long enough. although its weird to see her powers have evolved to include water x_x [[User:Vengeful|Vengeful]] 22:04, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
* i actually liked that idea, what about some steam or cloud? XD--[[User:Steven0328|Steven0328]] 22:12, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
** Is she? We're discussing on [[Talk:Tracy Strauss]] whether or not this is actually [[Barbara]]. We might have to credit this sister and her power as "Unknown triplet" and "Unknown triplet's ability" until we get confirmation as to her identity. Hopefully, we'll get some answers in next week's BTE.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 01:44, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*** It has to be Tracy. Barbra would never know any of the agents' names like Tracy. It makes sense that it's Tracy and I think she's going to have an interesting role in the next volume. --[[User:Jk84panhead|Jk84panhead]] 02:55, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**** Barbara knew Dr. Zimmermann, and if she was a fugitive like her sister, that's how she knows about Building 26.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 03:03, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*****Next season is gonna be fun:D--[[User:Fr0z3nB0nes|Fr0z3nB0nes]] 03:43, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
******Can we really confirm that she's the female baddie? I mean all we saw was that she killed Harper who was one of Danko's men. --[[User:Shlakime|Shlakime]] 06:23, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*******Bryan Fuller confirmed in multiple interviews (including the commentary for [[Cold Snap]]) that Tracy would return for the finale and they are not bringing in Barbara. --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 09:55, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
********From what I read, he just said Tracy would return (he didn't specify the finale). I'll check out the commentary, though. BTE said that Tracy wouldn't be returning.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 10:32, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
********* BTE said something along the lines of she was dead unless she could return from slushing around in the sewer. I took this as a sarcastic comment (heaps of their replies have been sarcastic) as revealing she was returning would be a major spoiler and BTE has never bluntly given away a major spoiler like that. We saw in the finale someone who could've returned from slushing in the sewers, so I think it was [[Tracy]]. Also, see [http://heroeswiki.com/Talk:Tracy_Strauss#From_the_crew here], it's confirmed. --<span style="font-size: 10pt; font-weight:bold;"></span>'''[[User:Elemental Manipulator|Elemental Manipulator]]'''</span> [ [[User:Elemental Manipulator|U]] | [[User_talk:Elemental Manipulator|T]] | [[Special:Contributions/Elemental Manipulator|C]] ]'''</small> - <span style="color:green;">When in doubt, ask BTE </span> 01:41, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
********** I also think she's Tracy and her power could have grown that large... But what I don't get is why, in the 12th chapter of the Agent (this week's) they needed to mention a Barbara among the fugitives who had the ability of water mimicry... Just as Tracy did in the Volume 5 trailer, they mentioned that Barbara flooded and threw water from herself to Jason's sister... Is it just a coincidence? I pushes one to reflect... is she really Tracy or '''does two of the triplets possess very similar powers'''? --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 10:14, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*Yeah! She's Tracy!--[[User:Themd|Themd]] 19:55, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
**rememer episode, noah talking to claire saying along the lines of "this is dangerous, someone was even found in dry room with lugs filled with water, people do that what else can they do?" maybe not noah but someone, this was when tracy was captive, not tracy, other triplet.--[[User:Autobot2|Hawkeye]] 11:23, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
possable assumption: pete may have absorbed sylars empathy when he touched sylar.--[[User:Autobot2|Hawkeye]] 11:26, 1 May 2009 (EDT)

...Wrong section, Hawkeye. This section is about Tracy, not about Peter's abilities.--[[User:ERROR|ERROR]] 15:00, 11 June 2009 (EDT)
***Nope, that was [[Donald Essex]].--[[User:Citizen|Citizen]] 12:55, 1 May 2009 (EDT)

== WTF SERIOUSLY? ==

USE CLAIRE'S BLOOD. COME ON. SERIOUSLY NOW. {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 22:02, 27 April 2009 (EDT)

[[User:IceGhost78|IceGhost78]] maybe the will explain it on behind eclipse
*Nah. They used that to save nathan last volume. It would be lame to do it again. Although I can't believe they really killed him. . .
** No they didn't. Peter used some unexplained kiss of life to save him. And the Heroes definetly know about Claires blood, its not like they were all brainwashed or anything, so this is just stupid.--[[User:Madheroesfan|Madheroesfan]] 04:48, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
***I would like to think that they didn't kill Nathan... but clearly they killed him as the graphic novels also says so... --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 09:55, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*The super-blood was a crutch that I'm glad they're not relying on too heavily. This gives some real weight to the program, and I commend them for the creative way to write Sylar "off" the show. --[[User:ZyberGoat|ZyberGoat]] 22:08, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*I agree, it seems very stupid. Noah was shot through the eye and most likely had serious brain damage, but Claire's blood brought him back right as rain. Nathan only had a slashed throat, Claire's blood should have been able to get him back on his feet easily. For that matter, when did Matt's telepathy get so powerful, and where are they getting Nathan's memories from.--[[User:Reflections|Reflections]] 22:08, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
::[[User:IceGhost78|IceGhost78]] sylar had nathans memories through clairsentience (spelling?)
::Angela and Noah explained it. "Nathan" will fill in the memory gaps with Nathan's possessions. --[[User:ZyberGoat|ZyberGoat]] 22:11, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*Well it looked like just regular thought implants. Just on a huuuuge scale.
***Oh, I must have missed it when he used clairsentience on Nathan, I thought he was interrupted by Claire. I also thought that it was not perfect, considering how he needed to bluff his way through two conversations. As for memory implants, yes it is just an implant on a huge scale, but he has never shown the ability to do anything close to creating permanent personality changes in individuals. In fact, he seemed to struggle controlling a few guards, I would assume that wiping a person's whole mind and implanting a new one would be just as difficult, if not more so. Edit: If Sylar/Nathan uses clairsentience on Nathan's possessions, then wouldn't Sylar be aware he is using said power.--[[User:Reflections|Reflections]] 22:15, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*While I'm glad they didnt, it doesnt make sense character wise not to use magic blood.  Sylar should have destroyed the body with his disintegration power.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 22:38, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
**Another reason I think they wouldn't do this is because this season (at least this volume, I mean) has been written as a second start so that basically any new fan could jump in and not need a great deal of background on the characters. They wouldn't know about 'magic blood' and that... would be a problem. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 22:42, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*Ah, I misrepresented my frustration. It's not at the writers or at the show. I think it was good that they killed off Nathan; it would be a nice change of pace. I'm actually kind of frustrated at the characters themselves. How could they be so stupid to blatantly ignore Claire's healing blood? {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 22:49, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*Well, the characters dont operate independently from the writers... :) -[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 23:04, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
**...I know. Ugh, never mind. {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 23:05, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
***I've seen two explanations online for why they *didn't* use any of Claire's RCR blood. 1) Nathan bled out for potentially hours, and either didn't have enough blood to regenerate, or was too dead ("stale"). In Season 2, Noah's body was rushed to the Company (possibly less than an hour even) and immediately injected. 2) When the decision was made for the Sylar-Nathan switcharoo, only Angela, Matt, and Noah was there (correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not sure if Mohinder was around or not). I don't remember if Noah remembers the properties of Claire's blood (it did save him, but was it fully explained to him?), but Angela and Matt shouldn't know. I guess Angela should have a hint given her deals with Adam, however.--[[User:Tim Thomason|Tim Thomason]] 00:17, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*They couldn't use Claire's blood to regenerate Nathan: she would have known that the "real" Nathan died. Peter and Claire were still looking for Sylar when Matt and Angela found Nathan. Angela, Matt and Noah are the only ones who know Nathan is not really himself (and that Sylar is not really dead). They would've had to tell Claire why they needed to take her blood and that would've ruined the plan. :) --[[User:Jessica13|JessicaHeartsMatt]] 10:30, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* 0_o  ... They wouldnt need that plan if Nathan was alive.... lol... duh.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 12:29, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* My first reaction was... oh non... why they didn't use Claire's blood...why all those lies and cunnings again...But after analysing a lot, I think there are some explanations and some plat-holes... I think there was a triple cause behind the decision to force Matt to do what he did... creating Sythan. (I'm saying from Angela's point of view) First and the most obvious is that she couldn't bear to lose her child... ("not now", not after she had just decided to unite her family back, stop lying and start loving...) Second she needed (and all of the evolved humans needed) Nathan to convince the president. And the third is she has so much faith in her dreams... that she totally believed that it should be Matt who would save Nathan. Her belief to her dreams are from her childhood ("1961"). Plus I understand that she didn't know the healing properties of Claire's blood. But what I don't get is why NOAH who knew it... didn't interfere. What? Did he have so much faith also to Angela's dreams? Nonsense. Noah also knew that Peter now have all of Sylar's abilities so... they also probably thought that Peter could be Nathan... and also probably Angela didn't agree as she wanted her son back. Anyway, at the end the only logical explanation seems to be Tim Thomason's... None other make any sense to me about why they wouldn't use Claire's blood. Ahh if only Claire knew what they did...  --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 10:02, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
**First and the most obvious is that she couldn't bear to lose her child -----Well She would not disagree if Noah tried to explain and use Claire's blood. That would not be a problem if they Nathan was alive, duh.
Second she needed (and all of the evolved humans needed) Nathan to convince the president.-----That would not be a problem if they Nathan was alive, duh. Oh hey, Peter could be of some use too wouldn't he?
And the third is she has so much faith in her dreams---- Her dreams do not always come true and she knew it. A character as smart as her would never stop Noah from trying to revive Nathan.
Don't worry Sylar won't stay there for long. Peter and Claire will be furious when they find out.

== WHAT THE- ==

tim, why?
why not just use claire's blood!
i rather mohinder's death over nathan's any time
i just hate this idea, cause nathans gonna be all evil now
--[[User:Steven0328|Steven0328]] 22:08, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*Now? Did you miss this entire season until two episodes ago? --[[User:ZyberGoat|ZyberGoat]] 22:09, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
** lol, no, i just think that he's gonna be a killer/sylar, now. --[[User:Steven0328|Steven0328]] 22:10, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*Perhaps that's why they let Nathan die? Becuase now Angela can control him better (or so she thinks). Side note: didn't she say Gabriel was her favorite? --[[User:Crazyaspie|Crazyaspie]] 22:14, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
----lol The series is always shouting Angela is manipulative. She would say the same thing to Flint Gordon if she wanted to use him.
* yeah, i guess. i just think that "nathan"'s gonna find a way to overcome that and find his "real" self. lol.--[[User:Steven0328|Steven0328]] 22:27, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
**Oh, for sure. Then he'll be pissed and go on a rampage or he'll see how long he can milk being Nathan before killing someone...it'll make next season superb!--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 22:50, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
***If you look at the past seasons and think about how the story almost always goes, ''of course'' Sylar will at some point (I'll estimate by mid-next volume) recover from the brainwashing. The series is laden in foreshadowing all the time... {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 23:03, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
**** Kinda makes you wonder how long before 'Sylar' seeks redemption.--[[User:Halfxwitted|Halfxwitted]] 23:06, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
***They didn't use Claire's blood purely cause there has to be "Normal Death" in Heroes and you cant keep bringing people back after they have been killed, if you use it then it opens up the door to heal every1 who dies. [[User:Lukas333|Lukas333]]
* It is the writer's responsibility not to create a HUGE plot hole. A good writer would find some explanation why Noah didn't try to use Claire's blood.
****Not unless they kill Claire soon. I was hoping Mohinder would bite it. What did he do this finale? Tell Hiro he couldn't be Hiro anymore. Thanks, Mo. RIP Nathan. :( [[User:GabrielPetrelli|GabrielPetrelli]] 10:46, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*Mohinder is a wonderful character!  (Does anybody agree with me anymore?)  He cannot die; he’s the voice of the show!  No, maybe he hasn’t had the best storyline these past two volumes, and yes, maybe he’s been showing up less and less on the show, but there’s always hope.  Come on, the next volume is called “Redemption”; it doesn’t get any more uplifting than that.  As for Nathan, he had to die.  Nathan has “died” in every season finale so far.  It just wouldn’t be Heroes if he didn’t die in this one.  Plus I really like the Sylar/Nathan thing.  I think there’s great potential in the idea.  --[[User:Mohinder613|<span style="color:green;">Mohinder613</span>]] [[User talk:Mohinder613|<span style="color:green;">(talk)</span>]] 13:31, 28 April 2009 (EDT) I think you guys are missing some major points here in why they did not use claires blood.  First off, Syler moved his "off switch" making it nearly impossible to kill him.  Not only would you have to sneak up on him, you would no idea where to stab him. The plan to make syler nathen in the spur of the moment was the only solution to stop syler along with bringing nathen back to stop the government from hunting special people.  Also, and perhaps the most important thing is during the episode, claires asks Angela why she does not go warn nathen to avoid something bad happenin to him and Angela response, I can not change the future, just give the events leading up to it a little push.  THEREFORE, according to her dreams, matt parkman saves nathen and this is the only way that is possible since Nathen throat was cut.  Thoughts?-Ottey321
::I agree with you Mohinder613 about Mohinder. He's a wonderful character (though I think still he can play better and why he's to speak always English, Why never his mother tongue...They can give same more shape to his character) And to Ottey321, I agree with you about Angela & Noah most probably thinking that this is the only way to get rid of Sylar was that... I also pointed out three other reasons up there. (WTF SERIOUSLY?)  Did you read it? What do you think? --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 12:34, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

== WOW!!!!! ==
I just watched the episode. AMAZING!!!! The end was cool... won't spoil anything, but they have a definant plot for next season!
*I thought it was very good and I loved the volume 5 teaser a lot, so I'm interested to see what they have planned for the next season. I'll have to rewatch it because I missed like a minute in scenes (live streaming can be a bitch), and for now I give this between a B+ and an A.--[[User:Citizen|Citizen]] 22:16, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
**so, an A-? :)--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 22:47, 27 April 2009 (EDT)

==Plot Holes==
Anyone else not understand how Sylar was able to fly? He never got this ability from anywhere.
* he simply absorbed it, ala peter, he can do that too, he just chooses not to.--[[User:Steven0328|Steven0328]] 22:27, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
** I thought he took it from Nathan through empathy. {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 22:26, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
* He used his [[telekinesis]]. When Nathan lands, his arms are spread out like an airplanes. When Sylar landed, they were pointed downwards, like they were steadying him or lowering him. --[[User:Crazyaspie|Crazyaspie]] 22:27, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
** The way I saw it, Sylar was clearly using TK. Like Crazyaspie said, Nathan lands with his arms out, while Sylar looked as if he has to 'push' himself up. It actually looked like when Iron Man lands (slowly), when I think about it. [[User:Hyperdude|Mike]] 22:29, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*** The sound effect used is that of flight. [[User:OUChevelleSS|OUChevelleSS]] 15:06, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*** that makes sense, i just wasnt really noticing it i guess. --[[User:Steven0328|Steven0328]] 22:31, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
**** No matter. If you haven't noticed, some little things like this can be confusing for some. :) {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 22:39, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*** Definitely not clearly. Nearly anyone's first impression would have been flight. It's up in the air, I don't think we could say one or the other at the moment. {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 22:44, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
**** Well unless Sylar has developed another ability letting him steal/absorb powers, there's no way he could have obtained flight from Nathan. We know that Sylar does have access to some form of empathic mimicry, but he's only used that, what, once? And then ended up killing her and reverting to can-opener-man. I understand that the first impression on anyone but someone who has been following the show since the beginning AND reading up on the BTEs and stuff would think it to be flight, but I'm just saying it would more likely be a use of TK (which we've already <s>seen</s> heard of). {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 22:58, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
**** One interpretation that I considered was that he absorbed the power from Nathan through empathy during the fight (see: shape-shifting). ''First'', though, Peter stole Sylar's abilities. ''And then'' Sylar stole flight and flew out the window; leaving Peter powerless to save his brother. Part of me thinks that this scenario may very well be played out in an upcoming graphic novel. Nevertheless, I wasn't paying attention too well, it probably was just TK or that unexplained power Sylar took that allows his to sort of teleport into Danko's car.--[[User:Halfxwitted|Halfxwitted]] 22:54, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
****^Not a power... --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 23:08, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
*****I agree. I'm still pretty convinced that that was for dramatic effect. Nothing more. {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 23:10, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
* I suppose you can submit it to CBR for clarification, but Sylar has used telekinesis to "levitate" many times in the past.  No reason to believe this was any different.  ([[User:Admin|Admin]] 22:56, 27 April 2009 (EDT))
* I don't doubt it's levitation and it probably was; given the explanation with the different landings of each character. I just think that it would be too difficult for 'Nathan' to accept that suddenly he can't fly at super-speeds anymore but rather merely levitate himself. --[[User:Halfxwitted|Halfxwitted]] 23:27, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
In [http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=20793 Season 3 week 29 of BTE] they throw around the Idea that Sylar aquired a few new abilities acting as a building 26 agent, he could have acquired Puppet Master and Flight from a few of his targets. --{{User:SacValleyDweller/sig}} 01:41, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**I would say it's most likely flight. If it wasn't, the new nathan is going to be very confused when he can no longer fly.
*** I think that Sylar never got Flight and that he levitate with TK when he followed Nathan into the room. However, I assume now Sylar has Flight because you could say that Sylar knows Nathan so well (much better than himself), he has empathically obtained Flight. Otherwise, like you say Nathan would be confused... - [[User:Master Dave|Master Dave]] 8:36, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

Yes, Thrashmeister, the debate on how Sylar was in the air is up in the air. Heh.

I believe that Sylar empathically absorbed flight.--[[User:ERROR|ERROR]] 15:25, 11 June 2009 (EDT)

== Hiro question ==

Maybe I missed it but was it ever explained why Hiro stopped time in order to "save" Noah from the tranquilizer? It does seems like Hiro's M.O. to risk his life to save another but I was under the impression he was leading everyone out of building 26.--[[User:Halfxwitted|Halfxwitted]] 22:43, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
* He was taking Danko out. I'm not sure exactly how it was that Hiro knew Danko was "veelain" (yup) and Noah needed saving... unless I've forgotten something from earlier this volume... Oh, with the plane crash, and all the nonsense after that, he's known Danko was bad and took him out. We'll find out a solid answer later I suppose. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 23:01, 27 April 2009 (EDT)
* If you walked in and saw somebody you didn't know trying to stab a person you KNEW, and who was a good guy, with something, wouldn't you try to stop him before it was too late? --[[User:Crazyaspie|Crazyaspie]] 23:32, 27 April 2009 (EDT)

==Nathan / Sylar==
How do we handle the Nathan/Sylar division, next season? Do we treat Nathan as dead, but still treat him as a Jessica-like subconscious (well, the *main* conscious actually)? Do we edit Sylar's page with all "Nathan" appearances next season, even in the unlikely event that nothing Sylary happens?

Right now (or when I started this discussion), Nathan is noted to be dead, and Sylar is noted to have been mindwiped into believing he's Nathan.--[[User:Tim Thomason|Tim Thomason]] 00:30, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* I think Sylar needs to stay as Sylar. He may be hypnotized into remaining as Nathan for a while, but he still has all of Sylar's abilities.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 00:41, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* Interesting point you bring up, MiamiVolts. I predict Sylar must start all over and re-collect new powers (except perhaps for TK [and/or flight since his brain believes he is Nathan] and intuitive aptitude; those seem to stick). --[[User:Halfxwitted|Halfxwitted]] 00:56, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
** I think the game's over once the first time he cuts himself shaving and automatically regenerates. He's already acting out of character, interested in clocks.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 00:59, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
****Not necessarily.  If he believed that he was Nathan, then he would have no memory of taking that power from Claire, so from his perspective it would just be the emergence of a new ability.  Sylar has the genetic information for all the powers he possessed up until that time, but he lacks the memory or knowledge that he has them or how to use them.  Sylar retained telekenisis after being infected with the shanti virus because the guilt and trauma of killing Brian Davis ingrained it into his genes.  But if you remember during the scene where Matt Parkman was erasing his memories and his life was flashing before his eyes, that memory was erased too.  So 'Nathan' would not have access to telekinesis or any other abilities besides Flight, Intuitive aptitude, and maybe clairsentience until he discovers or re-obtains them. -{{User:Barbedknives/sig}}01:12, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
***I thought the game would be over as soon as [[Lie detection|someone called him "Nathan."]]--[[User:Tim Thomason|Tim Thomason]] 01:03, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
****Tingling isn't something that you'd pay attention to very much (granted, he'd probably be detecting lies all day, being a politician and all). '''[[User:Advic|<font color="black">Ad</font><font color="green">vic</font>]]''' 01:26, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*****I say reguardless it's Sylar, Angela didn't give birth to him, he can't pass a paternity test for Monty and Simon (well I don't think he can), and he can't fly, and I'm talking real [[flight]], not [[telekinesis|self propulsion]]. I think the indication of clocks is evidence enough that Sylar will return one day, so everything that this 'Nathan' does next season should be on the Sylar page, just with a small note on the bottom reminding all veiwers that it's really Sylar...and maybe we should go ahead and just duplicate it on the real Nathan page too. Put the episodes on both of their pages as most characters belive it is really Nathan, but all fans know who he truly is. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and flies like a duck...then it could be a shapeshifter with implanted memories.--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 01:27, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
******Great point, but I still think it is going to be too confusing to treat him as Sylar until he completely reverts back.  For one thing, Adrian Pasdar is portraying a character who is essentially a groggy, burnt out Nathan Petrelli with a tinge of Sylar.  Fans know Adrian as Nathan, and with the memories of Nathan he is for all intents and purposes, Nathan Petrelli, until he develops a penchant for serial killing or remembers that he is Sylar, I think we should treat him as Nathan with a small note somewhere indicating that he was Sylar. -{{User:Barbedknives/sig}}01:34, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**Ya gotta remember that everything that makes Sylar "Sylar" is gone, memories, feelings, and that he really believes he is Nathan. So even if he did use a power he would have no idea what is going on. And Nathan saw Sylars body burn so the only ppl who knew that there was a Dead Doppleganger out there was Angela, Noah and Danko.. he'll have to do alot of digging b4 he truly beleives hes Sylar
***Don't forget Matt. '''[[User:Advic|<font color="black">Ad</font><font color="green">vic</font>]]''' 02:21, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

I see your point. Although we have an entire summer to plan this out, I'd like to see where everyone stands on this topic with that game all of us wiki-ers like to play: Sign this Consensus Check--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 02:03, 28 April 2009 (EDT)


'''<u>Where should Nathan/Sylar's volume 5 summaries go?</u>'''

<br>'''In [[Nathan Petrelli]]'s page (with a disclaimer)<Br>'''
I say treat it like how we did for Penny while she was impersonating Donna. He has the mind and body of nathan, even if it's sylar's original body. So yes, for now it's the same as nikki/jessica, in that Sylar is being repressed and Nathan has overwritten him.--[[User:Piemanmoo|Piemanmoo]] 02:27, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* We didn't know Penny was impersonating Donna or what was happening with Nikki/Jessica, so those are different situations. This is very similar to how Sylar impersonated Nathan in the explosion future, so we should keep the name Sylar as we did then.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 02:35, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

<br>'''In [[Sylar]]'s page (with a disclaimer)<br>'''
* Nathan is dead, fellows. Sad, but true. Besides, we made no such notes in pages of Danko, Claire or Sandra. -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 02:25, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* We know it's Sylar, and a few characters know it's Sylar too. Also, we have already kept the name as Sylar for "Sylar (explosion future)", so we have a basis to repeat. Since there is no consensus to change that, we need to follow suit.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 02:35, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* He's Sylar. Whatever characters are fooled into thinking, he has already begun to revert back to who he really is.--[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 12:49, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* We should put a note under Nathan Petrelli season 4, "Sylar goes through this season believing he's Nathan" and then elaborating on the Sylar page. --[[User:Crazyaspie|Crazyaspie]] 15:52, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* Fact is, Nathan's dead, Sylar's not. No matter how powerful Matt is, he cannot actually make Nathan come back to life or turn Sylar into Nathan. Even in the five minutes of episode immediately following Sylar's transition, we've already seen him acting odd. Sylar has transformed, but he's still Sylar. Whatever he does from this point on is still Sylar doing, but using Nathan's memories to impersonate him. Additionally, from what we've already seen, I don't think Sylar's DNA will stay hidden too long...But yes, whatever Adrian Pasdar does from here on out should go on Sylar's page. :) -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 22:50, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* Since Zach Quinto has said that Sylar would be back outside of Nathan, and due to promo clips we have seen, I think that we can put his stuff here. Nathan is no longer in control of that body, even if he thinks he is. --[[User:JHero|JHero]] 22:08, 26 August 2009 (EDT)

<br>'''In both of their pages (with disclaimers)<br>'''
*Agree, we know it's Sy, characters think it's Nate--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 02:03, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*That disclaimer better be friggin huge. Maybe use a third "Sythan" page as a template to cut down editing time too. '''[[User:Advic|<font color="black">Ad</font><font color="green">vic</font>]]''' 02:21, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*I like the "Sythan" thing... sounds like "Satan" ^^ --[[User:AoshiJP|AoshiJP]] 09:22, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* I would normally say "Put it in Sylar only", however, if you'll notice, we also have [[Maury Parkman]]'s fake Linderman on the [[Daniel Linderman]] page.  Thus, as long as Sylar is convinced he is Nathan, it should be on both.  ...But please, no "nicknames". --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 13:59, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
** Well, technically, that was neither Linderman nor Maury - it was an illusion. Maury himself didn't appear in Volume Three until ''[[Angels and Monsters]]''. -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 13:10, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*** It was an illusion created by Maury. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 00:18, 30 April 2009 (EDT)

<br>'''In [[Nathan]]'s page and only after he realizes he's Sylar, proceeding summaries in [[Sylar]]'s page<br>'''
*Best option. As long as for all intents and purposes he is nathan, we should consider him as such.
<br>'''In a totally new page for the Sylar/Nathan Character<br>'''
*Let's face it. He's not Nathan. He's not Sylar. He may as well just be a new person.--[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 12:45, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
** Except he's not "neither".  He's "both".  He is Sylar, with Nathan's body and memories "overriding" for now. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 13:59, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*Totally agree with this one, this was the first thing in my mind. He may be Sylar at heart, but he's 'in character' as Nathan. --{{User:Yamawhata?/signature}} 17:51, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*In the beginning I was thinking that we should put the summaries in Sylar's page as - I thought that - he's actually Sylar... but now after having analysed much... I think I disagree with that. We should have a new page for him as he's neither entirely Sylar nor Nathan, but someone altogether different. I think best is to write everything down to a new page, then put notifications (disclaimers?) to both Nathan and Sylar's pages about their combined future (or at least Sylar's). However though the word "Sythan" sounds interesting (and a little funny I find it), it's still a fan word. We've no official source (as far as I know) using "Sythan". So, I came up with the idea that it's best if we have: '''Nathan Petrelli (Sylar). --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 09:03, 11 May 2009 (EDT)
* Same as Niki's alter ego Jessica. - [[User:Josh|Josh]] ([[User talk:Josh|talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Josh|contribs]]) 18:37, 19 May 2009 (EDT)

== Does Peter know... ==
Does Peter know that Sylar's mind has been erased and he's now Sylar? 

While everyone was standing around the funeral pyre and "Sylar's body" was being burnt we saw Peter glaring and in a not-so-happy manner. Does he know about what his mother has done now? 

I really like this twist. I think the next volume will definitely be redemption for the show. Everything's back to being really interesting and I like it. Kudos to Bryan Fuller for saving my favorite show!--[[User:Jk84panhead|Jk84panhead]] 00:55, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*If he doesn't already, he will.  As soon as he touches 'Nathan' he will discover that he has multiple abilities, all of which he knew Sylar had.  Unless his ability replicates all of the abilities a single person has, like I believe. -{{User:Barbedknives/sig}}02:15, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**last nights episode proved peter can only take one from a multi powered person.
***It's also strongly hinted that he can choose from whatever abilities said person holds. But it's still a possibility that he doesn't get to "browse" the abilities but has either to take a specific power (like in "I'm gonna touch this guy and take shapeshifting") or gets a random ability if he doesn't specify ("I'm gonna touch that shackled person here and - whoa, where did the rest of the plane go?"). So if he'd touch Sylar while expecting to grab flight, he'd get flight, without knowing about any other abilities.--[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 06:16, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

== was Sylar using TK or puppet master? ==

making Claire pour wine and stuff, it looked like puppeteering, but the sounds were more like tk. Thoughts? --[[User:Piemanmoo|Piemanmoo]] 01:54, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*Puppetry:Ham::TK:spam...Meaning TK is the imitation in reguards to Puppetry, sorry analogies are on my placement exam lol.--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 02:06, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
** I say Puppetry --{{User:SacValleyDweller/sig}} 02:13, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**I'd say he took the power empathically from doyle, so yes it is puppetry.
***The only time Sylar has taken a power from someone empathically, it was with someone he was emotionally connected to (Elle).  I doubt that would be the case with Doyle, and he has never been shown to take powers like this since.  Plus, as stated below, Sylar has used TK to control people before. [[User:PrometheusMMIV|PrometheusMMIV]] 01:12, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
***In Season 1 he made Audrey Hanson point her gun at her own head. So perhaps it isn't puppetry. It could be though.
*I'd say TK. It somehow looked like Claire was being forced by an outside influence rather than being forced into involuntary movements. But that might be because I find TK (with which Sylar is so comfortable) more plausible. and the lines between the two are blurred; remember the incident when Doyle slammed Rachel into a wall.
***You can bet money that its TK.  (And by that I mean it IS tk.)  If it were puppet mastery, it would have been laid out for you specifically.  They seem to do that a lot now with dialogue, anyway. But yeah, this isnt the [[Audrey Hanson|first]] [[James Walker|time]] he has controlled someones actions with TK.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 10:08, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* Claire's movements look like she's physically resisting in a way that Doyle's victims didn't.  Sylar's gestures when forcing her to move are also consistent with his TK gestures, not Doyle's Puppetry gestures. --[[User:Ted C|Ted C]] 11:13, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

*i'm going for puppetry, cause when he uses the ability you hear like children laughing, and no TK sound [[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]] 18:23, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*He never took Doyle's ability.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 04:44, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
**You know this how?
*I know it was Doyle's ability... it didn't look like TK, and Sylar doesn't need to kill anybody to get an ability--[[User:Themd|Themd]] 19:34, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
**It actually ''did'' look like TK, since he was using his normal two-finger "push" gesture (my visuals may be a bit off...) and as someone above mentioned, it looked like Claire was physically resisting, something puppet-master victims can't do. And while Sylar does not necessarily need to kill someone to get their ability, it's rather doubtful he was able to achieve such an emotional connection with Doyle as what he had with Elle, the only example so far of Sylar having 'absorbed' an ability. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 23:37, 4 May 2009 (EDT)
***Sylar was able to use the empathy aspect of his ability to get shape shifting, it was confirmed by BTE. Just saying. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 18:15, 5 May 2009 (EDT)
****Forgot about that. But still - where would Sylar have found the empathy to connect with Doyle? In Elle's case, it was his remorse for killing her father - with Martin, was it the fact that he was basically killing himself? Or whatever (I'll read the BTE about it in a bit). Also, IIRC, in most cases where Doyle has used his ability, he's had his hand in an upside-down gesture (like if he was holding strings for a puppet) - Sylar was "pushing" Claire. Just saying. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 18:41, 5 May 2009 (EDT)
*****How often was Peter able to use empathy to absorb the powers of people he'd never met before. I don't think they need an emotional connection to the person in order to absorb the power. I'm pretty sure Sylar was using the Puppet Master ability, because when he made Claire sit down he stood up and walked around and didn't seem to need to concentrate on making her stay there which he would surely have to do if he was using TK. The whole two finger thing may just be Sylar's preference, but the way his hands move look like Puppet Master style.--[[User:Cazza09|Cazza09]] 10:31, 12 May 2009 (EDT)

* yet again I say its Puppet Master, we should add it to his abilities list -- ([[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]]) 06:33, 19 October 2009 (EDT)
** We'll add when one of the two happens: everyone in this wiki reaches a consensus, or then the show confirms it, neither of which being likely to happen, adding it to Sylar's power repertoire even less. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 11:27, 19 October 2009 (EDT)
*** I rewatched the episodes, and I know for sure its Puppet master, just rewatch the episodes and you shall see, I have two clips that almost 100% confirms this -- ([[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]]) 23:55, 19 October 2009 (EDT)
**** No confirmation, no consensus, no adding. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 13:12, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

== Nathan's last words ==
"I love you Pete, you know that." Oh damn... --[[User:JLYK|JLYK]] 14:11, 28 April 2009 (EST)
*More like "Ahhh, ugh, <nowiki>*crash*</nowiki>ow, <nowiki>*slice*</nowiki>gargle, gargle, gargle, ugh." lol<br>No, I'm kidding, but I think it's definatly worth being noted on his MQ.--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 02:17, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

==Major Death for Season Three==
*Nathan?  He's still (fake) alive!
*Tracy? Hard to tell, either dead and Barbara or has water manipulation.
*Sylar? Closest to dead as far as I can tell.
- and sadly Greg Beeman gone elsewhere :-( --[[User:Juba|Juba]] 04:46, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**How is Sylar the closest one? Nathan is technically dead. This season, he's just memories in Sylar's body. And the burnt body ain't Sylar, it's [[James Martin]] in Sylar's form.--{{User:NiveKJ13/sig1}} 13:40, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

==No Claire's blood? No Haitian!==
To all you complaining about Matt and Angela not using Claire's blood to revive Nathan, you're missing on the glaring flaw that they DIDN'T THINK TO USE THE HAITIAN TO TAKE OUT SYLAR!  I mean seriously, wtf, that's how they took Arthur out, and he was leagues above Sylar in terms of abilities.  But instead they choose to use a convoluted forced mind transfer to halfway bring Nathan back while taking out Sylar, not realizing how overly complex and very dangerous and backfire-probable the whole idea was.  Also, how would Haitian's ability affect shape-shifting?  Would it revert them to their original form?  Disuss. -{{User:Barbedknives/sig}}03:06, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*And where is the Haitian right now? They had less than  a day to stop Sylar, and the Haitian is all the way in Haiti. They used what they had. --[[User:Crazyaspie|Crazyaspie]] 03:40, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**I agree with the crazy person. They had to think on their feet. An hour later and they'd have to take out the president.--[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 05:18, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* Maybe Sylar killed him between Our Father and Dual? And about mental manipulation vs. shape shifting: Sylar wouldn't take his original form, because even death doesn't change it without shapeshifter's will. -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 05:05, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*The Haitian seems to have disappeared. Peter told him to go after Sylar and we never saw him again. I doubt he's dead, but he's probably not around where they can use him quickly. [[User:Deathwish|Deathwish]] 07:22, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*It seems that where [[illusion]] overlaid an image/false perception over the person, shape shifting physically 'rearranges' their body structure (hence the discomfort/permanence) --{{User:Yamawhata?/signature}} 17:51, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*Maybe he wouldn't return to his own form, but I think he wouldn't be able to do it again... well, while the Haitian is aroud--[[User:Themd|Themd]] 19:39, 30 April 2009 (EDT)

== New actors and characters ==

{{actor|actor1=Cloie Wyatt Taylor|character1=Nathan's aide|actor2=Michael B. Silver|character2=Liam Samuels|actor3=Jason Graham|character3=Jason (Special Agent)|character3image=Jason (special agent).jpg}}
{{actor|actor1=Roberto Sanchez|character1=Secret Service agent (I)|actor2=Joshuin Barker|character2=Frank (Special Agent)|character2image=Secret Service agent (II).jpg
|character3=Secret Service agent (II)
|character3image=Secret Service agent 2.jpg
|actor3=Alex Rapaport
}}
{{actor|actor1=Daniel Aldema|character1=Secret Service agent (III)|actor2=Bret Ford|character2=Secret Service agent (IV)}}
--[[User:Radicell|Radicell]] 07:43, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

== I don't understand ==
How did Peter manage to come into contact with President to touch him, so he could shapeshift into him? Why couldn't Matt, Noah and Angela wait for Peter to impersonate Nathan, so they could finally kill Sylar? -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 08:09, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
:*He did probably talk to Liam before going after Sylar. As for Noah and Angela not waiting for Peter: They probably wanted to leave Claire and Peter out of the loop; while both of them are ready to make morally questionable choices, Claire and Peter are probably not. And Angela probably wasn't quite ready to let go of her son. Plus, she has a lot of faith in her dreams. --[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 08:15, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**Yeah, he probably convinced Liam to let him see the President for a second.  As for Peter and Claire not knowing it was made quite clear that they hid it from them: Noah said that he sent Claire and Peter off looking for Nathan to buy some time.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 12:04, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
***Remember the 3 guards told Claire, Noah and Peter to get on the ground? And then Claire said "You either listen to us or I can tell you after you shoot me." I think from then, Claire Noah Peter convinced them about all this super powered people (if they don't already know), and that Sylar will kill the president after shapeshifting into him. So the 3 guards and Claire Noah Pete went to president and explain everything. So when they lead the "President", which is Peter, into the limo, all the guards around him already knew he was Peter. Annnnnd when they got into the limo the limo didn't take off immediately as they were waiting for Peter to own Sylar. JUST MY THEORY. --[[User:JLYK|JLYK]] 14:24, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*What I dont understand is how Peter made Sylar "un-shapeshift".  Im still really confused on that. --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 10:13, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
:*How about that: When shapeshifted, one looks like one person but possesses the DNA that dictates to look like another person (when James Martin posed as Sylar, he still had his own DNA). In order to force the body into a different shape one would need to focus on the desired appearance AND have "sampled" the original person's DNA (as opposed to conciously analyzing the original DNA and than alter one's appearance accordingly). So when Sylar touched Peter, he "sampled" his DNA. When he then tried to put on the president's appearance, he didn't have a "pattern" to model his appearance after, so his body flipped through some of the appearances already known until ultimately reverting back to the most natural appearance which would still be hard-coded in Sylar's own DNA. Sound reasonable?--[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 10:21, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
:**Putting it simply, Sylar got owned.--[[User:Fr0z3nB0nes|Fr0z3nB0nes]] 10:50, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
:*** Yeah. That too.--[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 10:57, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
***I think its like the term chimera (I think anyhow), when they shift theyre DNA mix and matches, with the core dna hidden. When Sylar tried to shift into the President, he tried to make MIX and Match from Mix and Match Peter, and so it fell apart and his core DNA surfaced.--[[User:Fr0z3nB0nes|Fr0z3nB0nes]] 14:12, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
***I think that's right. My explanation is slightly less technical, but: it works like a .jpg on your computer. When Sylar accesses someone's DNA, he makes an "image" of that person for later use. When he tried to make an "image" of the president, and let's say, set it as the background on his desktop, the file was corrupt. So Sylar was reset to his default image, that of his own... or, if you will, a red X. The people he cycles through on the way to it are very interesting... if you look closely, he nearly morphs in to Talb before he settles on Sylar. [[User:Product Placement|Product Placement]] 14:22, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
**Maybe shape-shifters have an immunity to other shape shifters. That seems to be the only thing that makes sense because it counteracted sylar's ability and made him lose control.

== angela ==

omg is it only me or does everybody thinks angela was so funny the part where she screamed 'NOOOOO' when she saw nathan dead. omg i accidently replayed that part and can't get it out of my headdddd okay sorry I AM NOT A PSYCHOPATH LOL. ---clueless
*I think it's safe to assume it's only you.--[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 09:05, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
** Personally, I thought it was some of her best acting. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 23:15, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
***Agree with LongBlackCoat, I guess its only you. It MIGHT be funny if Nathan wasn't the one who died and it wasn't such a sad moment annnd if it wasn't Angela but someone like Maya (who does that alot like ALLLLLEEEJJJJHAAAAANDDDDRRROOOOO!! NOOOOOO!!). I think it was great acting (agree with Ryangibsonstewart) as we always see Angela so calm, relaxed and smart. It just show how distress she was when she saw Nathan dead. I was distress too and I nearly did a Maya. --[[User:JLYK|JLYK]] 14:31, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! --[[User:Master Dave|Master Dave]] 09:03, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
--[[User:AoshiJP|AoshiJP]] 09:22, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*I know what you mean, its one of those [[Moral ambiguity|grey]] areas where you almost want to laugh at some funny aspect of the moment, but its really so terrible you feel like a creep if you do laugh. --{{User:Yamawhata?/signature}} 17:51, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
**The best part was that she wasnt as upset because it was her dead son as much as because it wasn't going according to plan.  What did she think would happen if he went after freakin' Sylar?  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 04:47, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
*I Believe laughing at a bit like this as known as Black Humour. You know you're not supposed to, but you do. Like someone falling off a chair in class.--[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 12:35, 1 May 2009 (EDT)

== How's Sylar gonna come back? ==

Personally I think he's going to realise that he's not Nathan, and his RCR will heal the memories that Matt removed / hid. Then he's gonna say "I'm back".

Also, even though I'm derailing my own post but shouldn't Tracy's power be changed to water mimircy--[[User:Fr0z3nB0nes|Fr0z3nB0nes]] 10:53, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* Unless we have a confirmation it's really Tracy - no. -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 10:58, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* I believe it will start with waking up in the morning, going to shave, and seeing Sylar in the mirror for a split second before he shifts back to Nathan. Little "wrong" things, like not remembering an old girlfriend, will continue for a few episodes until either a) "Nathan" meets Matt and accidentally absorbs his memories; or b) he attempts to fly and he can't, at which point his subconscious intuitive aptitude kicks in and he figures everything out. The writers have shown that Sylar is too powerful to be made subservient to any other person's abilities.  [[User:Product Placement|Product Placement]] 14:35, 2 May 2009 (EDT)

:*Second that. Even worse: He will take his time before telling anyone he's back... Good to know ol' man Noah's got an eye on him...--[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 10:57, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
:**And since Matt knows the truth, he could detect changes in SyNathan's mind and alert the others, making it harder for Sylar to hide if his mind comes back. --[[User:Egrethico|Ego]] 19:56, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
:*Then we'll have another 'I Am Sylar' episode. -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 10:58, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
:**Yeah, people like what they're used to. He'll probably screw with people's heads a little, too.--[[User:LongBlackCoat|LongBlackCoat]] 11:00, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
:***I believe Sylar will just remember who he was. They can't possibly make Sylar become Nathan forever. He already did his "the clock is running a minute and a half fast" thing just 6 weeks later. I am afraid Sylar will get angry and kill Matt X_X. --[[User:JLYK|JLYK]] 14:35, 29 April 2009 (EST)
* If the next season wasn't called Redemption, then I may have considered Sylar getting a fresh start to become a Hero for the long-term. However, I think he will slowly realize that he isn't Nathan half-way through the season. He will have another few episodes of 'finding himself' and then inevitably turn evil. This way the show can focus on a new baddie, kill them off and then Sylar can be the main focus by the end of the season. You know, [[The_Natural_Order_of_Things]]. --[[User:Halfxwitted|Halfxwitted]] 12:22, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* I'm gonna say Tracy (don't sass: it's her. Her frozeyface winked, remember?) continues her vengeance spree, eventually winds up at "Nathan's" door, and when she tries something funny, he manifests the old TK.  And it's all dominoes from there, boys and girls. --[[User:Sythan Nalar|Sythan Nalar]] 12:09, 28 April 2009 (CDT)
** An interesting theory: Tracy is presumed to be the bad guy in Volume Five (or at least the first bad guy).  Tracy would presumably meet up with "Nathan" at some point.  The moment he touches her and discovers parts of her history that he couldn't have known, he'll become suspicious. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 14:03, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
*So is Nathan's mind actually sharing a brain with Sylar's mind and Nathan's mind is dominating thanks to Matt or is it just Nathans memories are there and Sylars memories have been suppressed and so he must assume he is Nathan if it is only memories of him being Nathan are there....--[[User:Da carnivore|Da carnivore]] 22:57, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

* Guys, I suggest you play ''Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic''. A similar problem is described in this game. -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 01:43, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
**except the new identity given to Revan was completely new. They werent actual memories from an actual person.--[[User:Da carnivore|Da carnivore]] 18:01, 30 April 2009 (EDT)

== Will Claire's blood really bring him back?==

*Remember on Season 2, Noah and Maya only came back to life because Claire's blood was mixed with Mohinder's blood, which when combined becomes a cure to any illnesses.--{{User:NiveKJ13/sig1}} 13:21, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

And let me get this straight. 
*Nathan is dead.
*Sylar, without his past memories is now Nathan.
*The body they burnt is the body of [[James Martin]] in Sylar's form - which actually what Danko used as a decoy.
*And they didn't explain what happened to Hiro after losing concsiousness.--{{User:NiveKJ13/sig1}} 13:21, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

:Basically Claire cant give her blood to nathan becuase her,peter,and everyone else belives that Sylar is dead and Nathan is alive(Basically Angela told them a "lie"). Nathan is definately dead but his soul lives on in Sylar (Rip:Nathan), Sylar is now Nathan technically (Although he has shown signs of returning Sylar e.g Nathan examing the clock), It was certainly the body that was james martin (In the star wars type funeral) and yes Hiro had a Coma then the next thing we know is that he is fine (Well not really fine) Hope that helped you. :) [[User:Gabriel Bishop|Gabriel Bishop]] 16:24, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

**Uhmm, I know that, I just wanna emphasize the plot...--{{User:NiveKJ13/sig1}} 16:42, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**Noah came back to life with only Claire's blood. Not Mohinder's blood. And Nathan came back to life with Adam's blood only. The only reason they injected Mohinder's blood into Maya was because the Mohinder/Claire blood combination was the only blood sample that Mohinder had. {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 19:59, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

==I just thought of something==
For volume five, I think we're all expecting the re-emergence of Sylar. And because Nathan and Sylar are basically in one body (note I said basically, I didn't state that as fact), the writers could pull a similar thing they did with Niki-Jessica in early Season One. With Niki waking up in places she doesn't remember going. 'Nathan' could have blackouts, and freakish dreams of skulls being ripped open from a first-person persepctive. Also, wouldn't he still have the 'hunger'? I think that the new 'Company' could wrangle Baby Matt Parkman's ability to shut off the 'hunger' aspect of the ability, leaving 'Nathan' with an ability that allows him to absorb abilities in a similar manner to Peter's emphatic mimicry. Clairsentience would also add to this, as 'Nathan' would be able to understand what people are going through with physical contact. Any thoughts on my large block of rant? [[User:Adam148|Adam148]] 14:47, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

*Yeah the 'hunger' will be an issue especially with the whole clock deal at the end. I totally see memory blackouts and dreams being a part of the show, with a sort of jekyl/hyde feel. --[[User:Egrethico|Ego]] 20:11, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

** Why didn't you send this question to BTE????!!!! It's awesome!!!! -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 01:41, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
:::Great! how do I do that? [[User:Adam148|Adam148]] 15:52, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

== i feel sorry for angela.. ==

i couldn't help it... I cried when she screamed =( -- {{user:Meteoritu/sig}}

I laughed (even though I like nathan) and the scream reminded me of Alex Drake in the Ashes to Ashes finale :) [[User:Gabriel Bishop|Gabriel Bishop]] 16:29, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

* me too :( i felt so bad especially after all the crap angela's been through. and she's one of my favorite characters... christine rose is a great actress though [[User:Michael|Mike N.]] 16:53, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
** Indeed she is! -- {{user:Meteoritu/sig}}

== Sylar/Nathan ==

Ok... Matt told Sylar to be Nathan and he did.  But if Sylar is now nathan who were they burning?  Because Nathan was at the "bonfire", right?  How did they get two Sylar bodies?-- {{User:Catalyst/sig}} 16:58, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

* The corpse on the bonfire was [[James Martin]]'s corpse, which was still in deep freeze at Building 26. Noah retrieved it. -- {{user:Meteoritu/sig}} 22:01, 28 April 2009 (GMT)
**ooohhhh.  That was bothering me.  Thanks for clearing it up! :)-- {{User:Catalyst/sig}} 17:02, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

==Synopsis==
*Suspicious Claire: I dont think she already sees Nathans body, from where she stands she does not; there is the chain from Pátzquaro and "Nathan"'s answer to his left hand signature, also "Nathan"'s typical "you're coming?" which leaves Claire suspicious but not convinced of fake Nate. --[[User:Juba|Juba]] 17:27, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

== Thread vs. Threat ==

'''Thread''': A thread is a kind of thin yarn used for sewing.
'''Threat''': Threat may refer to an act of coercion wherein a negative consequence is proposed to elicit response.

Anyone got the information wrong, or is it really "An Invisible ThreaD"? -- {{user:Meteoritu/sig}} 22:33 (GMT), 28 April 2009

*It's 'thread'. Mohinder uses the term 'an invisible thread' in the narration. Plus it's 'thread' everywhere else :) - and in the episode's title card. -- [[User:Kevio|Kevio]] 22:33 (GMT), 28 April 2009
**It's yarn like on [[The map]] but also like on the [[rabbit]]: Sylar made his hand bleed cutting it, now Nathan is the rabbit with Sylar inside, but the thread is invisible ;-) --[[User:Juba|Juba]] 18:31, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
***...or in reference to the [[telekinesis|invisible threads]] that Sylar had Claire strung on, in addition to the [[character connections|invisible threads]] Mohinder mention that connects all of us...his monolouge did a really good job explaining this. If there's something that I've noticed, it's that the title refers to more that one thing in the episode.--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 00:47, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*Could also be a reference to Future Hiro's string timeline in the episode [[Five Years Gone]]. --[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 12:40, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
****Thanks everyone xD. -- {{user:Meteoritu/sig}} 20:37 (GMT), 29 april 2009

== tracy was naked at the end ==

[[User:IceGhost78|IceGhost78]] well if you have to die somehow...

Indeed, why was she naked? Water mimicry doesn't allow her transform clothes? -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 05:54, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
I saw this to (maybe i'm strange :D), maybe she can't do it to her clothes yet. Like how Peter and sylar can both shift clothes.

That girl from the Webisode could though right? --[[User:Master Dave|Master Dave]] 14:08, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

Her clothes were destroyed when she was shattered, and she hasnt bothered getting new ones because shes been busy killing.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 14:15, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
 
Yeah, besides, it gives viewers a reason to stick around for Volume 5. Big question is, will we see Tracy naked???? 
Kiddin' by the by, just in case anyone takes any offence. --[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 12:42, 1 May 2009 (EDT)

== Sylar's "flight", Peter's "all absorption" ==
Can we please not list this as CONFIRMED until they actually are? Everybody keeps updating the pages to say that Sylar has flight and Peter absorbed all of Sylar's powers, but there is nothing to actually suggest this. Unless I'm missing something. --[[User:Crazyaspie|Crazyaspie]] 20:54, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
* At the moment, I agree with you, since in the episode when they asked Peter if he absorbed ''all'' of Sylar's powers, he responded "....Yeah." Or something to that effect. Then with his "Bet you didn't think I absorbed ''that'' one." line, I started to think it he had no power of which power(s) he absorbed... I dunno, I'm kind of confused now. But then with Sylar's 'flight', I agree, it's almost definitely TK since there's no real way he could have absorbed Nathan's power. Logically. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 21:04, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**1. peter only absorbed one power. That's made pretty clear with him not being able to heal. 2. Sylar has flight. It wouldn't be a very good idea to trick sylar into thinking he's Nathan, and then make him suspicious by not letting him fly. -- Signyour Poste
***Peter had blood on his face but no wounds. I think he regenerated there. I believe he absorbed all of Sylar's powers. And I think Sylar levitated using telekinesis. Matt could have gave Sythan fake memories of losing the ability flight. --[[User:JLYK|JLYK]] 18:32, 29 April 2009 (EST)
**** When i watched the episode unless I am mistaken I saw peter regenerate his wounds. Just like in season 2 when Caitlin says there is blood but no wounds [[User:Gabriel Bishop|Gabriel Bishop]] 07:42, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
***** Yea, its either Peter did regenerate or the make-up artists did a really horrible job. --[[User:JLYK|JLYK]] 20:32, 29 April 2009 (EST)
****** He did not regenerate. If I recall correctly, when the heroes were watching James Martin/Sylar burn, the blood was cleaned off, but he still had wounds on his face. {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 08:33, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
***He did NOT regenerate. And peter's line "Bet you didn't think I took that one" confirms he chose which one to take. I know you want peter to be able to outclass sylar, but it just isn't going to happen. -- Signyour Poste

* Peter didn't absorb all powers, only shapeshifting, he can choose wish one he could take, also sylar didn't had flight, cause else peter would have fly after him, when claire asked him to fly after him, he said he can't. So if he took all of sylars powers he would be ably to fly, so this answers two questions
**1) He only took shapeshifting
**2) Sylar din't use flight but TK
[[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]] 18:32, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
***It doesn't actually answer that. If he only took one ability like it's confirmed, even if sylar had flight he wouldn't have taken it. -- Signyour Commente
**** Sylar has taken flight from Nathan. When he throws Nathan into the room, Nathan falls to the ground. Then you see Sylar descend from outside. If you listen at this point you can clearly hear the well known flight sound effect. With Nathan being on the ground, it must have been Sylar making the noise and flying. --[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 12:45, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
*****If I remember correctly, the sounds for flight and TK are rather similar - some kind of sharp 'whoosh'. Plus, if Sylar HAD taken flight, he likely would have been 'flying' faster than he was. He was more levitating than flying, and since we've seen/heard of Sylar using TK for levitation and even limited flight, TK seems to be the more likely candidate. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 19:50, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
******What are you talking about, they sound completely different. Can't you tell the difference between the two? It was clearly flight. Just listen to it again. And if that fails, again. If you are still not believing me then we will just have to wait for BTE to confirm it. --[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 20:14, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
*Noah said "Did you take his power?" NOT "Did you take all his powers?", also I think they made a point of using the Flying sound effect when Sylar came back in to show that Sylar did have it.--[[User:Cazza09|Cazza09]] 10:55, 12 May 2009 (EDT)

== Nathan/Sylar Fan-name ==
* We need one just to refer to him as for shits and giggles :P  I was thinking Sythan, or Nylar.  Thoughts?  :D --[[User:DarkPhoenix|DarkPhoenix]] 21:18, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
**I already jokingly suggested Sylathan right after the episode aired.  In part to clear up some confusion, many of the contributors can't let go of the idea that Nathan is basically still alive, so listing actions that 'Nathan' commits on Sylar's page will be too confusing for fans in my opinion.  But since I'm outnumbered on this one, we're still considering him 'Sylar' *sigh* -{{user:barbedknives/sig}}21:26, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
***There is nothing about this Nathan that is actually Nathan. He walks like Sylar, talks like Sylar, and has kraayzeeh moments just like Sylar. Everybody who is watching knows it's Sylar, and I promise you that Angela and Noah will be discussing "Nathan's" kraaayzeeh moments and call him SYLAR. There is no reason at all to put it under Nathan. Nathan is dead. --[[User:Crazyaspie|Crazyaspie]] 22:49, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
****well my friend pointed out that Gabriel + Nathan = Gathan (Gay-than) lol--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 00:33, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*****LOL Gathan. Maybe he should be Sythan Gabtrelli or Nalar Petgray. Sounds weird. --[[User:JLYK|JLYK]] 14:38, 29 April 2009 (EST)
*I like sythan gatrelli a little better. -- Signyour Poste
**Good thing it Nathan's name didn't begin with an M or we'd have a fan name equivalent to a type of tarp material...[[User:Dracomaster4|Dracomaster4]] 10:07, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

I don't get it, Dracomaster4.

Long live Nylar Graytrelli!--[[User:ERROR|ERROR]] 16:07, 11 June 2009 (EDT)

== New Picture ==
Its just, WOW. "Sylar" funeral with "Sythan" face over it, pretty much shows what happened in this episode. The best episode picture so far in my book. --[[User:JLYK|JLYK]] 18:40, 29 April 2009 (EST)
:Yeah, seeing that moment in the episode was kind-of ironic, I thought... --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 09:29, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
***If you mean the main image, thanks! :D I was actually thinking of using the long shot of the bonfire scene with the other characters before, but it would look similar to the Graphic novel's main image LOL.--{{User:NiveKJ13/sig1}} 10:37, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

== Danko's intention? ==

I really didn't understand why Danko wanted to knock out Noah? What was his purpose? --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 10:28, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
He's an evil backstabbing midget.  Do we need a further explanation?  Of course we do.  I think he just didn't trust Noah and figured he'd knock him out before Noah knocked Danko out.  --[[User:Cosmic AC|Cosmic AC]] 03:14, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
: it's clearer now...This is all suspicion thing, you're an agent, you don't ''trust'' anyone...and because you don't trust, you take ''measures'' to "protect" yourself... Thanks Cosmic AC, personally sometimes I've difficulties understanding suspicious people..as I generally try to see the best in people :) --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 07:50, 30 April 2009 (EDT)

== What did he mean? ==

Rewatching the episode, I noticed something else. Noah says exactly like this to Matt:

''And it has to be right now. I don't know how much time we've by both sending Peter and Claire after Nathan.''

Does this mean that they (Peter & Claire) know? Were Noah or Angela sent Peter & Claire after Nathan? Does this mean they intended to bring Nathan back to life by Claire's blood or something? May be with that sentence Kring wanted to imply that it's too late for Claire to bring Nathan back to life... What does everyone think? --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 10:52, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*It means Noah told Peter/Claire that Nathan was still MIA after flying out the window with Sylar. The two go out looking for Nathan, giving Noah/Angela/Matt time to do the unthinkable. I still hold hope that Nathan's body was preserved, and could be revived later... [[User:GabrielPetrelli|GabrielPetrelli]] 13:39, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
**Which means they purposefully disregarded that Claire could heal Nathan or Peter could pose as him instead.  God, thats retarded.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 14:19, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
***Here's the thing. I think when Noah was shot he didn't die, but was close too so they put him on life support until they could get her blood infused with his. People throughout history have had blows to the head and survived. When it was first used on Nathan he was still alive as well. So I take it that her blood only works on someone who is still alive, and seeing how Nathan clearly died it wouldn't have worked. That is my best and most logical guess. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 14:31, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
****He was shot through the frickin' eye.  He was layed out, he had the same glazed over eye that Claire and Peter had when they died.  They said he was dead.  DEAD.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 04:52, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
*****Agreed. And also agreed that HRG disregarding Claire as an option was also stupid. [[User:GabrielPetrelli|GabrielPetrelli]] 10:22, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
*Noah died! How could anybody survive that?--[[User:Themd|Themd]] 19:51, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
**A guy in real life once had a metal pole that went through his head. He still survived but had some brain damage.--[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 00:51, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
***But when Sylar shot Maya in season 2, it was close to the heart and would have probably pierced it. Maya would have died within minutes, and probably did, before Mohinder revived her. I suppose it's a question for BTE --[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 12:49, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
****This is something I wrote in a topic above, and I'll say it again: Volume Four was written with the idea of it being a fresh start for the stories, characters, and fans (old and new). As far as I remember, there was no reference in Fugitives to Claire's blood's regenerative properties. Setting this point aside let the writers make for a potentially exciting fourth season. And also made for a fan war about why they didn't use her blood. :P {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 01:56, 2 May 2009 (EDT)

*****Guys, I'm often seeing the abbreviation '''BTE''', but I don't know what it means. (Also what's WTF?) Could anybody tell me what it stands for or what it means? Thanks --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 04:47, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
******'''BTE''' stands for Behind The Eclipse, a series of interviews with episode writers a day or two after each episode. ''WTF'' stands for What The F__k. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 15:07, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
*******Thank you Mike :) --[[User:Janrodrigo|Janrodrigo]] 16:08, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
********No problem. {{User:Hyperdude/sig}} 19:45, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
*********BTW (By The Way), it's not What The F__k, it's "What The Fudge"!!! --[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 20:09, 2 May 2009 (EDT)

== i don't understand ==
I don't know if I'm missing something, but I still can't understand why would Angela and Noah would want Sylar to be Nathan. Yes I understood that it's because "Nathan's the only person who can tell the president he's made a mistake" but why is he still Nathan six weeks later?
Oh, and why did Angela say "please Matt, I can't lose my son like this"? Does she want to have another Nathan to mourn the loss of the old one?

Can someone answer these two questions for me? Cause I can't really understand this, specially the first one. -- {{user:Meteoritu/sig}} 20:43 (GMT), April 29th 2009
* Cause they think that without someone like Nathan remaining in office, the government would choose to hire 100 or more Danko-like people to run units that hunt down everyone with abilities. Of course, they could have had Peter pretend to be Nathan, but then Angela would have to trade one son for another. I think that would have been the better choice, but Angela couldn't bear it so she chose to try and make a monster (Sylar) act as her son. Noah should have known better, but with all he has been through, he isn't thinking clearly either. I think that Peter will eventually have to lead (like the the biblical Peter), but the question is how many characters will get killed by Sylar before that happens. I'm not too optimistic. :(--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 15:59, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

== Too many qoutes ==

I'm not the one who does the quotes, but it seems to me some of them can go. For example,  "You're number four." -Tracy. There's just too many on the page at the moment. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 16:11, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

== Explain please ==

Can anyone explain what happend exactly to sylar when peter shaked his hands ( as the president) why sylar, shapested in all of the persons he already shapeshifted once? [[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]] 18:40, 29 April 2009 (EDT)
*My guess is that Sylar was trying to morph into the president, acquiering a DNA sample from the handshake. However, since the president was Peter in shapeshift, Sylar was browsing through his shapeshifts to find the president and failed, thus returned to Sylar.--[[User:Ikkian|Ikkian]] 19:09, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

== trivia ==

*I think is should be listed how many times was sylar called a son of a .... in the episode i think it was various times by diferent characters--[[User:Cj31094|Cj31094]] 20:07, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

*Whoever got that doomsday time piece of trivia, nice find! --[[User:Trevorrrj|Trevorrrj]] 03:08, 11 July 2009 (EDT)

== noah vs. nathan ==
Is this note necessary? When Noah was shot in the eye, he lost a lot of blood as well, not to mention the bullet proceeded into his brain. -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 02:38, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
Not to mention it's more of a fan...I can't bring myself to use the word.  Anyway, it's not trivia.  It's some random person's idea (the oddly-placed ellipsis is evidence of this, I think).  Let's remove it, please.  --[[User:Cosmic AC|Cosmic AC]] 03:19, 30 April 2009 (EDT)

== Some more things to sort out about Sythan ==

So aside from the discussion of where Sythan's summaries should go (which are above), there's also a few other issues...
#In [[character connections]], if the Sythan in Volume 5 interacts with someone, should the connections go under Sylar? Nathan?
#When writing summaries about Sythan in other articles, how would we link it? We could call it <nowiki>[[Sylar]], or [[Nathan]], or pipe links such that [[Sylar|Nathan]] or [[Nathan|Sylar]]</nowiki>. I guess this really depends on the discussion above, of where we talk about the Volume 5 Sythan.
#When assigning image categories, and we have an image of Sythan. Do we add [[:Category:Images of Sylar]] or [[:Category:Images of Nathan Petrelli]], or both?
--[[User:Radicell|Radicell]] 06:04, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
*There is always an options to create a new page...  Sylar (as Nathan) But other wise it should go in Sylar's page.  --[[User:Master Dave|Master Dave]] 13:46, 30 April 2009 (EDT)
**Yeah, create a new page called Sylar/Nathan (or vice versa). I gave this idea above. so if you agree, add your comments. --[[User:Mc hammark|Mc hammark]] 12:53, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
***I don't like having a seperate article for [[Jessica Sanders]], but this is kind of the same situation. - [[User:Josh|Josh]] ([[User talk:Josh|talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Josh|contribs]]) 20:28, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
****Jessica was a separate personality of the same person, Sylar is made to believe he's someone else who actually exists, it's a separate person, Jessica was just named after an actual person. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 20:32, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
*****Nathan is a seperate personality of Sylar (that has overwritten his main personality). Niki made herself to believe she was someone else who actually exists, a seperate person. Actually, [[Jessica Sanders|the Jessica personality]] was based on [[Jessica Sanders (Niki's sister)|Jessica]], just like the Nathan personality is based on [[Nathan]]. - [[User:Josh|Josh]] ([[User talk:Josh|talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Josh|contribs]]) 18:44, 19 May 2009 (EDT)

== WOW! ==

That was an amazing episode!

I guess "Nathan" will become Sylar pretty soon... He can heal his memory right? Just like Peter... maybe he will [touch] something on his office that will make him remind that "He" was there, so he will try to think about it... and maybe he will recover his own identity... Or he will realize that "he's not him" when he's healing from any wound, like a shaving cut... or when he wakes up having another identity crisis... or when he discovers he can do so much more than just flight.

And is Peter able to choose what ability he wants to have? or he has every single ability from sylar?--[[User:Themd|Themd]] 15:35, 30 April 2009 (EDT)

*Or when he asks her mother who am I? and she says: Nathan (then something in his head tells him that's a lie)--[[User:Themd|Themd]] 20:03, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
*Telepathically telling a person to forget who they are is different from forcibly erasing their memories. I don't think he can heal from that. But obviously, some of Sylar is starting to break through the Nathan facade. {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 21:49, 2 May 2009 (EDT)

*I'm not sure about healing his mind... but I'm pretty sure he will heal any wound, so, maybe he will start to wonder what happened to him--[[User:Themd|Themd]] 15:10, 3 May 2009 (EDT)

== Coyote Sands... ==
Just a question, but did anyone else think that the place they went to burn "Sylar's" body looked a lot like Coyote Sands? Or was it just me? --[[User:Scorvi12|Scorvi12]] 05:52, 2 May 2009 (EDT)

Yeah, it was Coyote Sands... Kinda think it's appropriate to include something built up like that over more than one episode... Also, possibility of Coyote Sands being the ground of the Next Company? 
-Oh, and that also explains why everyone was gathered at Coyote Sands at the finale party (minus Tracy), as that was the last location shot.
*It would be pretty cool if it was coyote sands.--{{User:Catalyst/sig1}} 20:11, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
* It is, I rewatched the scene and recognized an abandoned building behind them. It is the one where they gathered in 1961. -- [[User:Altes|Altes]] 09:08, 6 May 2009 (EDT)


== Possible Resolution to Sythan problems ==
Since no one has a clue where to put anything for the interesting sylar/nathan combo, why not make a page for Sythan. List how he came about and instead of worrying as to where to place story updates for the characters, it could just be updated there. I think it would save a lot of time and energy and if sylar were to regain his memories, sythan's page could note this and then sylars page would be updated from then on.
*That's already <s>a topic</s> actually a few topics of discussion...Look (^)that way.--[[User:Anthony Gooch|Anthony Gooch]] 17:01, 12 May 2009 (EDT)

== FINALLY,AN EXPLANATION TO WHY THEY DIDN'T USE CLAIRE'S BLOOD! ==

FINALLY,AN EXPLANATION TO WHY THEY DIDN'T USE CLAIRE'S BLOOD! Jack Coleman said so in his blog why they didn't use Claire's blood. Here's the part where he said so:

"4: Why didn't we use Claire's blood to revive Nathan? In Season 2, ep. 9, Claire had just given blood to Bob for the very purpose of healing someone. When HRG got shot, he was in the clutches of the Company, and given an immediate transfusion. This time around, there was no Bob or Suresh on the scene, there was no bag o' blood waiting to be utilized, there was no time. Nathan's throat was slit wide open and he bled out."

Well it explains everything now.--[[User:ZeroTime|ZeroTime]] 00:16, 6 June 2009 (EDT)
*That actually really makes a lot of sense. Nice find! {{User:Thrashmeister/Autosig}} 20:38, 6 June 2009 (EDT)

So... There was no blood ready? They could have just taken more... Although, the fact that he bled out would be a good reason, as the blood has to circulate, and with no blood already there...

Nice find! Finally, an explanation! :)--[[User:ERROR|ERROR]] 16:19, 11 June 2009 (EDT)


I guess my question would then be, is there a point when someone (with or without RCR) permanently dies? Arthur was shot in the head with the Haitian around and was killed and Future Peter was shot in the chest with the Haitian around and died. However, the many instances of brain penetration (e.g. Claire, Peter, Sylar) allowed them to come back when the brain was no longer penetrated, and both Sylar and Claire actually died during the eclipse that took away their powers but came back (Sylar himself actually died just like Nathan did, his throat was slit and he bled out). The main inconsistency is that Noah was shot in the eye and considering that there is no bone between the eye socket and the brain, it seems like his brain had to have been penetrated. Again the main question here is at what point does someone permanently die? It seems like brain death would happen almost instantly if shot in the head so regardless of how quickly he was given Claire's blood, his heart would have stopped beating and his brain would have already been dead, just like Nathan's brain would have been dead since he bled out. I would be ok with JC's explanation if it was also explained, how long you can be "dead" before you can no longer be brought back. [[User:Clay wise|Clay wise]] 17:48, 3 September 2009 (EDT)

== Invisibility ==
Actually, it wasn't Matt using telepathy with the invisibility sound effect. It was Sylar morphing into Nathan with the sound effects for invisibility, telepathy, intuitive aptitude (tick-tock) and, of course, shape shifting. I also heard TK and something like phasing. {{User:Altes/Signature}}