View source for Episode talk:Brave New World (Heroes)

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==Brave New World==
* I thought it was good but i think we will not see a New episode of heroes anymore, but on the good side I think Peter got his old powers back --[[User:Skyeatsout|Skyeatsout]] 22:06, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**He still has the same old power. But Oh My God that was a great episode! I was pleasently surprised at how it ended. 13/10 in my opinion!--[[User:Icefire227|Icefire227]] 22:09, 8 February 2010 (EST)

==Aww, for a second I thought pete had his powers back==
It took me a couple seconds to register that he just grabbed samuel's power after tackling him. How disappointing.[[User:Gamerelite1|Gamerelite1]] 22:07, 8 February 2010 (EST)
* Yeah, it took me a moment or two to realize this. Especially since Samuel was like "Ah, I see you've got my power now..." 22:08, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**That got me too. Oh well, he seems to have doubled his IQ since he got his new power...--[[User:Ratclaws|Ratclaws]] 23:04, 8 February 2010 (EST)
***Pretty sure he replicated flight to get there so fast with Sylar given how fast he can fly.  I thought he'd take one of Sylar's abilities to battle Sammy but I liked this better.  Even a sort of nod to Nathan there: he tackled Samdei the same way.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 23:22, 8 February 2010 (EST)

== Will Heroes be back for Volume 6, "Brave New World"? ==

I want to see how the rest of the Heroes Wiki fanbase feels about this. I honestly think we'll get to see at least another season. Hopefully NBC sees the value in all the new stories the writers could come up with, with Sylar turning good and all that. Bad bad Sylar is a hackneyed story by now. 22:10, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*After the conan fiasco, I think they'll be keeping heroes. Doesn't make sense to get rid of a show that still makes money when they don't have anything to replace it with.[[User:Gamerelite1|Gamerelite1]] 22:14, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**Yeah I really hope they have another season. But just 1 though, enough to give the series a proper send off. Any more and it will start to just get hella lame. I think 5 or 6 seasons is enough for any show. And I really miss Conan.--[[User:Icefire227|Icefire227]] 22:15, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*** I'm with you, Icefire. Especially if NBC announced it IS the last season: build up the hype and whatnot. And shut up everyone who's been calling for it to happen. 22:18, 8 February 2010 (EST)
****It would be nice if Heroes came back, but at this point I couldn't care less. All the cool characters have been ruined, all the stories have been hastily wrapped up, and it seems they've re-tread the same old plot again, and again, and again. A total reboot would be nice.--[[User:Gibbeynator|Gibbeynator]] 22:31, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*****To be fair, Sylar being GOOD is already a hackneyed story. But I don't hope for Heroes to end anytime soon. --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 22:33, 8 February 2010 (EST)
******In the event it does go down, I hope it frees Hayden up so she can go back to Kingdom Hearts.--[[User:Gibbeynator|Gibbeynator]] 22:40, 8 February 2010 (EST)
****I really hope Heroes isn't over.  The way I see, it's finally gotten back to season one quality, and I think they have a lot of room to expand.  I'm not hoping for another three seasons or anything, but I really would like to see where they go with Specials being revealed. --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 22:34, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*******Kingdom Hearts and Heroes never coincided?--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 22:50, 8 February 2010 (EST)
********Hayden was replaced by Alyson Stoner in Re:Chain of Memories and 358/2 Days. Granted, she would have had minimal lines in both games, but yeah. Maybe Hayden will be back for Birth by Sleep if Heroes does go under.--[[User:Gibbeynator|Gibbeynator]] 08:07, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**** My question is, with Sylar going good-guy now, who's gonna be the bad guy? I mean, the show's gonna die without some major conflict.  What I think would be an intresting twist is if Parkman went evil on us.  Samuel's gone, both Companies are finished, HRG is playing the overprotective dad, and Peter's power is still completely lame.  I think it would be cool if Claire went hard-core just like the Outbreak Future. It sorta fits now that the world knows about the people with abilities. So ironic. Gotta love the writers.--[[User:Dance4thedead|Dance4thedead]] 21:20, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***** I'm pretty sure if everyone knows about specials, then there will be new people coming out of the woodworks as hunters, other specials trying to connect, or fanatics.  plenty to build on.--[[User:Jas3point14|Jas3point14]] 00:43, 11 February 2010 (EST)
*I really think the best way to end it would be with Claire revealing her ability.  End of series.  But, they already put in the volume six title and "to be continued", so it would kinda suck if they didn't keep it going.--[[User:Boycool42|Boycool42]] 19:50, 21 February 2010 (EST)

== Peter's battle with Samuel ==

My guess is he replicated flight to get to Central Park really fast, getting it from Sylar.  I loved how he tackled Sammy with it, nice touch there.  I also loved the battle there, though I wish Samuel was killed instead of arrested.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 22:13, 8 February 2010 (EST)
* If [[Robert Knepper]]'s down for it, maybe they'll bring him back in future episodes. I'm glad he's still alive. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 22:16, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**I like how he was arrested actually. Too many TV shows end with the main villian being killed.--[[User:Icefire227|Icefire227]] 22:18, 8 February 2010 (EST)
***Samuel has probably been one of the most interesting villains on the entire show and I'm really glad they kept him alive. While his fight wasn't the best, I was still pleased with it. I hope they bring him back, seeing as he could possibly become the new big recurring villain (since Sylar is a good guy now...which in my opinion just ruined his character) and bring back the trend of having villains with only one power. -{{User:Vampirate68/sig}} | 22:32, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**Well its Robert Knepper, Im sure he can BREAK out of PRISON.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 22:34, 8 February 2010 (EST)
***Haha, very true (Get's the Prison Break plug) -{{User:Vampirate68/sig}} | 22:35, 8 February 2010 (EST)
****Sadly he won't be breaking out. he seems to be completely powerless without a few specials around.
*****I'm very very happy Samuel's still alive. He seems mostly harmless without anyone around him, but there's always the chance someone could spring him from prison and he could become a threat again. And he's also less likely to simply be killed at the start of Volume 6...[[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 04:56, 9 February 2010 (EST)
******Was anyone else getting visions of Spaceballs when Samuel tried to attack Peter without powers?--[[User:Gibbeynator|Gibbeynator]] 08:26, 9 February 2010 (EST)

==My personal opinion on this episode==
Honestly, I had pretty good view of this seasons overall, I ''loved'' the last few episodes, but this one let me down. It felt somewhat rushed, but more importantly, it was far to convient and tidy. The one scene that pisses me off the most is where Claire, Noah, Eli and Edgar have an "intervention" with the carnies, and for whatever reason the carnies believe them over their leader. What were they thinking?

"Oh, hey look, that drama queen's going on about something, she sounds kind of urgent."<br />
"She ''always'' sounds urgent..."<br />
"But she sounds really urgent this time! Oh look, Noah and Edgar walked in!"<br />
"The guy that murdered Lydia and the guy that ran away?"<br />
"Yeah, they're backing that girl up! It must be true!"<br />
"Wait, hold on. One of these persons has a penchant for killing specials and the other left us when confronted by our leader, implying guilt. How in God's name do they make her argument more compelling?"<br />
"Well... I... Oh hey! Eli walked in! He agrees with them! That guy always seemed to have it together!"<br />
"He came back a month ago after Joseph kicked him out and stares at our women all the time..."<br />
"No, no. They're definitely right."<br />
"Are you honestly saying that you're talking the opinion of four adversaries of the carnival over our trusted leader?"<br />
"Yeah."<br />
"Ah. All right then, let's bail."<br />

Doesn't that look ridiculous to anyone else? And then Samuel's left powerless and screams pathetically at no one, repeating himself over and over? Besides being horribly cliched, it was just way too predictable. I guess at this point the writers realized that everything was tied up a little too tightly, and devised some introduction into the next season while making us all feel nostalgic with a familiar line ("My name's Claire....."). Thoroughly disappointed by this.

Hiro's plot was what kept this episode from being total trash, although that twist (We all had no idea where he/she was, but they were living amongst us this whole time?!!) was already used earlier this season. Still, I felt for Hiro. I'm sorry for this absurdly long post but I really just needed to vent....--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 22:19, 8 February 2010 (EST)

*I dunno, I feel like a former carnie, a less-former carnie, and "the enemy" agreeing would be enough to at least pique their interest.  All it would have taken was Damian to prove it. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 22:22, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**My point was that it didn't just pique their interest, within the space of a minute they were totally convinced.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 22:25, 8 February 2010 (EST)
***"And then Samuel's left powerless and screams pathetically at no one, repeating himself over and over?" You do realize this is because he didn't expect Hiro to show up, with Ando, and save the day by teleporting dozens of specials away? Samuel figured they were all running and hiding, and he could still influence them if they were? He's a little crazy, hence the screaming pathetically at no one. 22:40, 8 February 2010 (EST)
****Shouting the same line over and over? Again, this isn't so much a criticism of his acting as it is a criticism of the writing. Everything ended up way too tidy, way too quickly.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 22:49, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*****He sunk a entire town. That has to still be on their minds. Plus, some never fully trusted him to begin with. I really enjoyed this episode, and hope they do come back for next season.--[[User:Ratclaws|Ratclaws]] 23:03, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure [[Eli]] admitting to killing [[Lydia]] was the last nail in the coffin.  [[Samuel]]'s right-hand man turning on him is a pretty powerful statement. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 23:11, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**I'd agree, except for that fact that Eli walked in half-blazed, speaking somewhat incoherently. Also, he's not the most reliable of characters, he's sketchy beyond belief and the carnies know that Joseph had kicked him out before.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 00:58, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***I think you're being a little uncharitable. Samuel's stock with the carnies wasn't exactly high to start with, due to the sinking of the town. You then have Samuel's right hand man admitting to the deed of killing of the few people they ''were'' fond of in Lydia ''on his orders''. That in itself should be enough to get them to turn on Samuel, regardless of Eli's personality. Edgar backing him up doesn't hurt. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 05:01, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I think it *was* a good finale. And as for Samuel shouting, repeating himself... I think it was brilliant. He is an utterly mad, crazy man by now, after all that has happened him recently (most imporantly, losing Vanessa, but also the beginning dissent among his carnies (in my opinion, they have started to not trust him before the revelations of this episode)), and now he also loses (most of, or all of) his power. His reaction is exactly what I expected, shrieking in incapacity.<br>Of course, this is my opinion, you are entitled to yours.--[[User:DrIstvaan|DrIstvaan]] 11:13, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**The doctor sums up Samuel's character well. Besides, how was Samuel repeating the same line, anyway? I heard about half a dozen different ones, personally. "They can't have all left" "Where are you?" "They can't leave me" "You COWARDS!" "Come back here!" "You're nothing without me!" And so on and so on. Now, if he was screaming "Where are you?!" over and over again, you would have a point, but he wasn't. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 11:32, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**Right, I was trying to imply that this is the way everyone should observe the episode, I was just personally disappointed. I still disagree about the carnie's trust thing, but that's just my thoughts.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 15:33, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*** As a note, their interest started building when Claire told them Samuel killed Joseph. His reaction, "ENOUGH!" shocked them, one little girl looked terrified. He spoke down on them; "They're nothing without me", and then Edgar and Eli came in to verify it. I would have been convinced if I were them too.--[[User:Riddler|Riddler]] 16:46, 9 February 2010 (EST)
****To be fair, Claire had just claimed that he had killed his own brother. While that's true, if I didn't previously know that he had killed Joseph I wouldn't have been too shocked by his reaction. It's quite the accusation.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 20:25, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***** While Claire's argument built up well against Samuel, the carnies already don't really trust her, and especially hate HRG.  I don't think Eli was the most popular carnie, even if he was Samuel's right hand man/men.  Edgar was an outcast and carnies seemed to accept the idea of him as a traitor.  I know that not all of the carnies trust Samuel, but I think what was really missing was the mob mentality.  When people are grouped like that and the truth come out, they seldom just sadly walk off.  I really expected Damian to step up and say something since he could show Eli and HRG's memories.  So yes, I feel things were off with the scene, but ultimately, the episode was rushed, and I think that's the main thing to blame.--[[User:Jas3point14|Jas3point14]] 01:17, 11 February 2010 (EST)
****** I think they were shocked by his reaction because it was more violent and angry than shocked. Especially with the quotes he added in: "You think they'll believe you over me?" "They're nothing with out me." Etc.--[[User:Riddler|Riddler]] 02:45, 11 February 2010 (EST)

==Peter and Emma==

Please tell me I wasn't the only one who said <nowiki>"awwww"</nowiki> when Peter and Emma hugged!  These two are adorable.  Thoughts on next (possible) season?  Peter and Emma as a couple, maybe? --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 22:27, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*Was hoping for a kiss myself, but there's hope there.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 22:32, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**And then she will get lost in space and time[[User:Gamerelite1|Gamerelite1]] 22:33, 8 February 2010 (EST)
***Damn edit conflict, I was just about to say that X(. Seriously though, I think they'll either be together or very close, but I don't think it will be focused on that much.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 22:34, 8 February 2010 (EST)
***Fully agree with Gamerelite1!  I've been shipping these two from the start, and though I'm rather afraid that Emma's going to get offed, she's significantly more popular than Simone or Caitlin ever were (though that doesn't explain poor Charlie), and I can't see the show killing her off just yet.  Either way, [[Pemma]] is pretty much the most adorable thing, platonic OR romantic, since Hiro and Charlie. --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 22:37, 8 February 2010 (EST)
****This episode actually did pretty good as far as killing off extras goes- Lauren's still alive, Samuel's still alive, all the carnies (including Eli and Edgar) are still alive, and Emma's still alive. Barring a mass clear out at the start of Volume 6, I think we've a good chance of seeing their relationship grow next Volume. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 05:03, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*****I'm inclined to agree.  It's felt to me all season like they were setting this up as a ''realistic'' romantic relationship, which is something we've yet to see on this show, unless, again, you count Hiro and Charlie.  Starting out as friends and developing into something more, you know?  But I kind of hope they don't pull a Caitlin on us, because of all the heroes, Peter probably most deserves at least a little bit of happily ever after, considering all the BS he's been through (mostly because of his family).  --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 10:40, 9 February 2010 (EST)

== What Matt did to Eli ==

I think Matt told Eli to go back to the Carnival and reveal the truth and then leave.  Why else would he have done that and what else could he have ordered him to do???--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 22:33, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*Uh. well that was obviously what happened.[[User:Gamerelite1|Gamerelite1]] 22:36, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*Hm, that's interesting.  I suspect that there were many more orders involved in that whammy, and I'm betting it's going to be explored next season (provided there is one), along with Bennet owing Tracy a favor. --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 22:55, 8 February 2010 (EST)
A better question is how Eli got from Los Angeles to New York so quickly... --[[User:CourtesyofTVRage.com|CourtesyofTVRage.com]] 23:54, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*Whoever or whatever that has been teleporting the carnival and its inhabitants is probably responsible for that. It suddenly occurs to me that we will probably never know the exact mechanism behind that feat.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 00:12, 9 February 2010 (EST)
In my opinion, I think Eli hadn't been trusting Samuel lately. The way hes reacted in the past couple episodes... Of course, I believe Matt had something to do with his confession, but I think some of it was himself. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 17:14, 9 February 2010 (EST)

== Power ==
Why did Samuel's power drain ''completely'' when most of the specials were teleported away? Peter was right next to him and Sylar, Doyle and Emma were near, weren't they? He was able to create a sinkhole under a mansion and collapse a police station by himself.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 22:53, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*That's a valid question.  Plothole? --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 22:54, 8 February 2010 (EST)
**I don't think he lost it completly, he just lost all that extra power that gave him such an extreme ability.  He's just significantly weaker now.  Peter had the same ability and same amplification, maybe one special (well four if you count, Emma, Sylar and Doyle as well) just wasn't enough to give him that large boost which makes sense.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 22:59, 8 February 2010 (EST)
***It looked like he was just waving his hands while nothing happened.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 23:00, 8 February 2010 (EST)
****It's possible that Peter used his replicated terrakinesis to prevent him from moving anything. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 23:01, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*****Or he could have been trying to do something major and as he lacked the power anymore nothing happened.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 23:04, 8 February 2010 (EST)
******I'm leaning toward either Peter using Terrakineses to stop Samuel, or Peter stealing Terrakinesis from Samuel entirely, taking away the thing that made him special, more than a carny, but that's a theory that could possibly be explored in the next season.... which NBC should totally do! [[User:PowerSink|PowerSink]] 00:29, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*******I doubt Peter removed Samuel's powers totally, he can only ''copy'' abilities.  My guess is Samuel was just really weak, remember, in one episode in a flashback he couldn't even lift a boulder with just Joseph around.  I don't think he has the level of power Sparrow does or her power stemmed from having Rebel around and all of the people on the plane, which come to think of it, might explain how she was able to survive that fall in Rebellion Part 2: her power was amplified enough by the people on the plane that she could do it.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 00:34, 9 February 2010 (EST)
********Samuel was only a kid then, and he's proven that he can do semi-amazing feats alone, like the ones listed above. However, I doubt that Peter took Samuel's power, because Samuel used it for a few moments longer even after Peter mimicked it.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 00:35, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*********Considering he ''battled'' Peter with it I'd say Peter didn't take it from him, so maybe the writters simply made him practicaly powerless to emphazie how much he relies on the carnies.  The only things we've ever seen him do with no other people around are kill Mohinder and Joseph and he was probably drawing off their powers although he may not have needed to.  The Carnival seemed to be close to that town he destroyed and I think the Carnival was in Canin when he destroyed the police station given a flyer seen there so he probably was able to draw off the evolved humans there.  We have no idea of his range with that but its probably within a mile or so maybe and maybe the more evolved humans there are the more the range is.  I think he tried to do something big, but couldn't manage it due to his lack of power and if he tried to do something smaller, something would have happened.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 00:55, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*********Now I'm thinking that Sparrow's power is different from Samuel's. At least Sparrow could use her powers without any large number of specials around.--[[User:Gibbeynator|Gibbeynator]] 08:38, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I think Samuel's "range" is large enough to account for the carnivel's evolved humans when he sank the town. There's no way he'd have been able to do it based on this evidence otherwise. Given that a few evolveds were still left in the carnival grounds, one might argue he'd been tapping into that power so much right before they all vanished, that it left him so drained that he couldn't move anything. Either that, or he was trying to sink the entire place as before, but no longer had the power to do so, as WarGrowl says. Or Peter stopped him, etc, etc. There's many possible explanations, but some slight tremors when he tried at long last might have made things simpler. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 05:10, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**Ok, for the "in range" part, I think that it works a bit like light waves. If the sources are in different areas of the carnival (which they seemed to be) then the amplitude of that special force they give out would be completely different. Much like scalars in physics, if they are close, the power adds up together and would give a further range, further apart and it's only individual ranges.  And as for Sparrow, we have no evidence that her power is based on those of the others'. I'd guess her's is a "that's your limit, you can't go over it nor under it" kind of power. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 05:54, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***There's actually a very simple explanation, now that I think about it: Samuel's "range" is large enough to incorporate the distance between the town and the carnivel. Hiro took the carnival members somewhere very far away, outside of this range. Further, Samuel was trying to do something major with his Terrakinesis, as opposed to just levitating rocks. Therefore, Samuel couldn't get enough power from the specials left in the carnival to do whatever it is he was trying to do- earthquakes, swallowing people up, etc, etc, and so nothing happened. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 13:18, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**The closest other special in the vicinity is Peter, who currently must also be rather powerless because he has the SAME ABILITY AS SAMUEL, thus nothing to really draw from. And we've seen how weak Samuel's ability was back when the carnival had like 12-15 people in it. It took him forever just to close up Joseph's grave in the first episode. Now theres only about 5 specials within a close range to him. --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 13:29, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**I don't think Samuel's 'Range' is physical... But more of a spiritual proximity bond. For example, he was able to destroy the police station without any specials around physically, but the carnival was 'with him' spiritually. Samuel was still able to draw from their powers here because the other specials were within his stronghold, still 'under his control', but spiritually as well as physically, when Hiro teleported them away, they were gone.--[[User:NW|NW]] 
**** I agree, he tried so hard to get his new family's affection and they let him down. --[[User:Juba|Juba]] 16:17, 10 February 2010 (EST)
14:14, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***I think that the reason Samuel couldn't do anything is because he was trying for something too big. Maybe what he wanted to do required the power boost he got from others, so what he tried to do didn't happen. If he had tried something that less flashy, something which required less power, he'd be able to make it happen. That's how I understood it. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 18:37, 9 February 2010 (EST)
****I was going to say the same thing as you Intuitive Empath.  A moment ago he was trying to sink almost all of Central Park which would really require extreme amounts of superpower even for a special (I don't think we've even seen Sylar move something remotely that large and his telekineses is pretty powerful).  Then when all of the carnies are teleported away, it'd be like a bodybuilder that can lift a car trying to lift a building.  He may be pretty powerful still with 5 or so specials around him, but not powerful enough for what he was trying to do.--[[User:Jas3point14|Jas3point14]] 01:25, 11 February 2010 (EST)

*We don't know how close the carnival really was when Samuel created the sinkhole under the mansion and when he destroyed the Police station. We saw when he destroyed the town that the range is at least a few miles, and considering how easily the carnival can move around it's not difficult to believe that the carnival is near enough to give him the boost in his power he needed.

When the people of the carnival were teleported out the drop in his power would have been so sudden it would have caught him off guard and he didn't expect it. Like other people have mentioned he must have been trying something he no longer had the power to do and the result was nothing happened.--[[User:Cazza09|Cazza09]] 21:22, 22 March 2010 (EDT)

==Charlie==
Anyone else think that the actress who played Old Charlie resembled Jayma Mays alot?--[[User:Icefire227|Icefire227]] 23:43, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*Its hard to tell looks wise when the age difference is so vast. I did however think she did an awesome job acting like Jayma Mays. I loved it.--[[User:Cairoi|Cairoi]] 01:48, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*K Callan has always been one of my favorite actresses, ever since seeing her on Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman.  Personally, I don't think they could have gotten a better stand-in for Jayma Mays.  It was a really touching, heartwarming way to wrap up the Chiro storyline. --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 12:37, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I agree... She had the same stare and gentle attributes that Jayma has. I could believe it was her in her older years.
*Agreed, she was perfect for the role. When she first appeared I had to do a doubletake to convince myself it wasn't simply the same actress in heavy "aging" makeup (maybe with digital help or something). --[[User:Maelwys|Maelwys]] 15:31, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**''Exactly'' how I felt. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 17:20, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*** Ditto. It was my favorite memory of the episode, and probably one of the coolest ways to wrap up a storyline in the season. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 11:17, 10 February 2010 (EST)
*Did she have Charlie's accent?--[[User:Boycool42|Boycool42]] 20:12, 21 February 2010 (EST)
** Yes, very much so. It even specifies in the script that she has a bit of that old Texas twang. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 20:37, 21 February 2010 (EST)
***I thought so.  --[[User:Boycool42|Boycool42]] 17:21, 22 February 2010 (EST)

== new actors and characters ==

{{actor
|actor1= Jennie Fahn
|character1= DC hospital nurse
|character1image=Mercy Heights nurse (II).jpg
|actor2= Ron Franco
|character2= harlequin clown
|actor3= Charly Emery
|character3= CGNN reporter
|character3image=Female reporter.jpg
}}
{{actor
|actor1= Allyson Roche
|character1= Sally
|actor1image=Sally.jpg
|actor2= Shane Conrad
|character2= CGNN reporter
|character2image=Male reporter.jpg
|actor3= K Callan
|character3= Charlie
|character3image=Old Charlie.JPG
}}
-- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 23:22, 8 February 2010 (EST)

== Question ==

With that ending, was it the series finally. I really hope there's another season, it's a great show. [[User:Homersimpson|Homersimpson]] 23:49, 8 February 2010 (EST)
*They introduced a new volume at the end of the episode which implies that they ''think'' there's going to be another season. However, this may or may not be true.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 01:05, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I personally am hoping that it's only the season finale, not the series.  The episode was a bit clumsy, but the ends all came together nicely and turned into some plotlines that I think could end up being really cool and interesting.  It all depends on how the writers handle it, I guess, but I personally am looking forward to a Season 5.  I don't even want two or three more seasons, but one more just to wrap some things up would be nice. --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 13:22, 9 February 2010 (EST)
** Considering you're posting on a ''Heroes'' fansite, Clairesxtwin, I think you're in good company in hoping that this was just the season finale and not the series finale. :) -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 11:19, 10 February 2010 (EST)
*** Definitely agree.  I hope it airs for another season.  IF it were a series finale, they really should have extended it to 2 hours imo.  The episode felt rushed as it was and an extra hour could given them the time to fill things out which is what I think the episode needed.  Even the previous episode could have used more development on Sylar and Peter's years trapped together (a montage really wouldn't have cut it).  To make it really feel like they spent a long time together and had time to bond, it should have spanned for more than one episode (one episode devoted to it would have been too focused on them, hour long tv episode needs some diversity).--[[User:Jas3point14|Jas3point14]] 01:32, 11 February 2010 (EST)
Why would the reporters keep filming Claire committing (as far as they know) suicide?--[[User:Thanatos|Thanatos]] 06:51, 12 February 2010 (EST)

== Chiro ==

I guess they weren't fated to be together. I really hoped that Hiro would go to the past and stay with Charlie, because getting her back could cause a paradox, but no... this time, no Quantum Leap happy ending. {{User:Altes/Signature}} 02:56, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I was really hoping that Hiro would go through with his 1944 plan...and it was kind of heartbreaking that Charlie didn't even want him to, at the end. Not the ending I wanted, but I'm happy the arc finally has some closure. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 05:12, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**Just as a sidenote, I imagine placing her in 1944 was a specifically calculated move in that Hiro is a (very) Japanese man.  Having him go back to World War II America would have been suicide. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 09:31, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***Lol--{{User:Yoshi n1/sig1}} 10:31, 9 February 2010 (EST)
****Thats actually a really good point.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 13:22, 9 February 2010 (EST)

==Disappointing==

Does anyone else think this is quite disappointing to see in a finale? I was kind of wishing at least one main character to end up dead, for that grieving effect. And at least some explanation or extensive use of a power. Some of the character's destiny was quite unclear, like Matt's and Mohinder's.
Plus, if ever there will be(though I highly doubt it) a next season, I see no other paths for the show to take other than a season 3 like series(regular versus special humans). Or having regular humans accepting existence of the specials and all lived happily ever after until some new villain turns up *yawn*.--[[User:Realistic|Realistic]]
*On that note, I think they made Mohinder a Graphic Novel character now, not to be appearing on the show again in a possible 5th season (other than perhaps guest starring). They kinda indicated that when he just ran off in Pass/Fail and his story got continued in a GN --[[User:Smouvy|Smouvy]] 9:54, 9 February 2010 (GMT)
**I was shocked that Mohinder wasn't in this episode at all and not even mentioned.  I'm sure they could have worked him in somehow, maybe explaining that Samuel gets his power from the carnies or even helping them to run away from Samuel or something...
**I dunno, I don't think it'll go down the path of "humans vs specials". I think it'll be more like Torchwood, anyone see that?, where Noah's in a secret company everyone knows about but it's denied. Plus there's the whole new storyline of "Sylar - criminals beware, there's a new superman in town". Can't wait. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 05:57, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***This was a bad finale in my oppinion...--{{User:Yoshi n1/sig1}} 10:32, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***I thought it was a really excellent finale.  It wasn't as good as, say, HTSAEM, but it was the best finale we've had in quite awhile.  I think it opened up a lot of new pathways for them to explore.  The Heroes writers tend to have a way of surprising us.  Just when we think it's going to turn into crap, they completely turn it around. --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 12:40, 9 February 2010 (EST)
****Most likely Claire will become a celebrity, some extremist groups fearing her.  Others will seek out the same fame with their abilities, some will try and stay hidden.  I like the idea of Sylar/Superman.  That would finally be a new direction for the character, and it makes sense given his want for attention and power.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 13:25, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I don't believe it was a bad season finale, but I was expecting a little more. Maybe a little more action between Samuel and Peter, and much more special effects. They only seemed to shake the camera every time Samuel used his powers!, lol - {{User:Jenx222/sig4}} 13:39, 9 February 2010 (EST)</span>
** PERFECT FINALE!! Especially since now claire is the face of the specials, which makes the most sense because she cant die. [[User:Daevon|daevon]] 17:21, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***Perhaps Claire will become an ambassador for her people, following in her bio-dad's footsteps as a politician and her other dad's footsteps as a liaison to the others.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 01:48, 10 February 2010 (EST)
**** I really hoped Rene would come and Claire would die. Because Noah is right, people don't change, and we've seen two futures where they knew about evolved humans. This can't end well. {{User:Altes/Signature}} 06:06, 10 February 2010 (EST)
* I found the ending to be predictable and anti-climactic...well at least for most of the stuff that happened. I guess the thing I'm most happy about is the fact that Samuel is gone, and we don't have to listen to any of his obnoxious speeches anymore... God, that man loves to hear himself talk! --[[User:Punxas|Punxas]] 10:15, 10 February 2010 (EST)
*See my post above. I was throughly disappointed by this end to an otherwise fantastic season.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 16:33, 10 February 2010 (EST)

== Tracy ==
* How did Tracy get Noah and Claire out from the sunken trailer, as in what were the specifics?  Do you think that they "liquified" just like Tracy or did she just use her power so strongly that it turned all the dirt into muddy, muddy water?  Just thought I'd get some ideas, cause that was pretty cool.  Overall, the episode wasn't as intense as The Art of Deception but it still left me wanting more.  I really hope it doesn't get canceled.  --[[User:Nicknameguy|Nicknameguy]] 08:05, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**I assumed muddy, since she asked if they could swim. If she was going to liquidise them then there'd be no reason for the question. But I was surprised at the fact she then disappeared. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 08:08, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***Since they came out of it intact, I'm going to say that Tracy made a giant pool for them to escape from. Everyone knows that, in sci-fi, demolecularizing multiple objects and then trying to put them back together is VERY hard.--[[User:Gibbeynator|Gibbeynator]] 08:23, 9 February 2010 (EST)
****My guess is she created a giant pool of water and pulled them into it and they swam to the surface.  As for her, she probably just left afterwards, using her water ability to move through the ground.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 09:14, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*****I actually assumed she extended her ability to them intitially, but either explanation is possible. I dislike the idea that she made the earth into water as that would then effectively give her liquefaction as well as invunerability to physical damage and freezing. On the other hand, we didn't see Noah and Claire reform out of water as Tracy did, so...[[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 10:34, 9 February 2010 (EST)
******When she reached into the crack in the earth from which she came, I figured she was going to use water pressure or water erosion to move the dirt out of the way to create a larger tunnel for them to swim through (which would be why she said something along the lines of: "I hope you can swim").--[[User:Jas3point14|Jas3point14]] 01:37, 11 February 2010 (EST)

== Peter's current ability ==
I wonder if Peter copied Samuel's ability as it is, thus he can only use it (effectively) in the vicinity of other evolved humans or was this thing with the relation between evolved humans and the strength of the power specific to Samuel, in which case he has Terrakinesis proper.
I guess we'll never know... I imagine that if there will be a next season, Peter will have replicated a new ability in the meantime.--[[User:DrIstvaan|DrIstvaan]] 11:02, 9 February 2010 (EST)

== Company ==

So I guess there wont be a new company now.--{{User:Yoshi n1/sig1}} 13:01, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*Well, from what I understand from the GNs, etc., Tracy has sort of been playing Professor X, which would imply that there will at least be something along those lines, if not a <nowiki>"true"</nowiki> Company. --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 13:23, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**So far, the world only knows about Claire, but if I see the name for the new volume, I think that the world is going to know about abilities in general. And if that happends there is no need for a new company.--{{User:Yoshi n1/sig1}} 13:33, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***Actually there ''would'' be a need for a new company. As Noah said, all it would take is "one Sylar" for the world to turn. The new company would most probably take care of those like Samuel who would try to use their powers for worse, much like the villains level 5. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 13:58, 9 February 2010 (EST)

== Evidence Peter Has His Original Power Back ==

I just rewatched the episode and I think Peter got his powers back after emerging from Sylar's nightmare. If you watch, the whole rest of the season whenever Peter "borrows" a power his hand kind of glows and the cameras make it extremely obvious. In this episode while arguing with Parkman, Peter decides to use his ability, but the cheesy special effect never goes off and before he reads his mind Peter telekinetically spins Eli 180 degrees so his head is beneath Peter's feet. Then at the carnival Peter and Sylar are split up and there weren't supposed to be any known fliers around. From a continuity standpoint we never see Peter run into the fleeing carnies or Claire and Noah, and Sylar is dealing with his own situation in the tent. Also, it's never explicitly stated how Sylar and Peter got to the carnival so there's not definitive proof they flew their either and Peter had "borrowed" it from before. On my second watching it just seemed all too plausible (not 100 percent, but certainly a strong case can be made) that Peter got his powers back by forgiving Sylar in the last episode. Hopefully we get to find out next season...
*All good, but also, all speculative. There's a reasonable explanation for all those points. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 16:23, 9 February 2010 (EST)
* It would have been really awsome. To bad because Sylar turned Eli into Peter his direction using TK (you see a shot where Sylar is twitching his head then Eli's body starts to move). Then what about Flight, you would say... well he probably got that from Sylar. I really hope Peter has his powers back it was way more fun that way. --<span style="font-size: 8pt; font-weight:bold;"> [[User:Futurepeter|Futurepeter]] ( [[User:Futurepeter|U]] - [[User_talk:Futurepeter|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Futurepeter|C]]) 16:24, 9 February 2010 (EST)</span>
**I must disagree on both counts. It wasn't fun to have an invincible main character running around kept in check only by his lack of intelligence, nor would it be again. Nothing about the case is really very strong...the entire argument rests on "We didn't see how Peter did X, Y is a possible explanation for X, therefore Y is true." This is no more reason to believe that Peter has EM then that he doesn't. Special effects (or lack thereof) effectively mean nothing in terms of what powers are being used. Sylar most likely span Eli around, the only method by which Peter and Sylar could have gotten to New York from Matt's so quickly was to fly, so Peter borrowed flight from Sylar for that. The very evidence you use in support of Peter gaining back EM can be used to argue ''against'' the fact he has EM. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 16:40, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***Except now Sylar is good.  He has the same power Peter used to have, plus many more.  Peter had the original EM, and it made him unique as a character, both in this story and in the superhero/fantasy genre at large.  They need to give him back his power quickly, or kill him and let Sylar take over for the both of them.  [[User:Ruler|Ruler]] 17:45, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I disagree: at first I thought he had telekinesis but it had to have been Sylar, he probably copied flight to get from LA to New York in time (makes sense) and he replicated terrakinesis from Samuel while tackling him.  It's also not true that they show that light every time: they didn't show it when he got shapeshifting (I kept rewinding that part the other day and could see no evidence Claire saw it), when he took super speed or Siren's song.  They probably just cut it out for time's sake and to give us a bit of a surprise.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 17:01, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**Gotta disagree Ruler. I see the point that Sylar now being good makes Peter somewhat redundant on sheer power, but I'd never give him EM back. At most I would give him the power to take multiple abilities temporarily, so he can still kick some ass without having the power to break the story in half. Personally I'd find a way to depower Sylar to his TK and leave it there. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 18:37, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***If he got Samuel's "special" terrakinesis, and not the ordinary version, he currently has the potential to be ''very'' powerful.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 19:17, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*Sylar spun Eli around, Peter replicated flight from Sylar (both to fly to New York and knowing that flying would be the only way he could get close enough to Samuel to replicate his power), and then replicated terrakinesis from Samuel.  He still has AR. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 18:43, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I was under the impression that Peter had taken Sylars original power, his [[intuitive aptitude]], after their time together in "Whammyville."  Sylar had gotten to the point where he could take abilities just from being in the same area, or by touching, and would cut open the head just for kicks.  This is essentially what Peters original power was, apart from the empathy part.  So if Peter can pick and choose what power he can take from a multi-powered super (and he has), why cant he take IA.  This allows him to push thoughts, fly, and fight using a just-replicated power seamlessly.  Could be a way to please those who clamor for him to have his original ability without just having Ando super-charger or other lame cop-out.  --[[User:HandsOffMyPeter|HandsOffMyPeter]] 19:32, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**It took Sylar several years before he began to (sort of) control The Hunger. I think this is the thing that would keep Peter away from IA. He knows what it's like and his last attempt with it didn't go particularly well.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 19:40, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***Hands, you're correct in that he could take IA from Sylar, if he wanted to. But given what happened the last time he acquired that power, he would naturally be very wary of getting it again, even if it could make him more powerful. PJDEP, a good point on the special terrakinesis. There's actually a good reason to think that he ''does'' have Samuel's power as opposed to regular Terrakinesis. When they are fighting straight after he mimicks the power, all the other carnies are still there, right? So if Samuel was empowered by all of them and Peter wasn't, Samuel should have murdered Peter instead of having to struggle for control over the earth. The balance between them seems to indicate that Peter was tapping into that same force, and so would be able to access it in the same way as Samuel did in future. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 05:31, 10 February 2010 (EST)

== What the f***. ==

Not sure what the "BAD WORDS" policy is here, so until someone censors me I'm going unrestrained.<BR>
LUNG REGENERATION?<BR>
WHAT THE F***.<BR>
Didn't Claire's bio-mom already cover that lack of air could kill her, if temporarily?<BR>
FAIL.{{User:Vanguard/sig}} 20:36, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*I think Bio-mom  told her that her mind makes her think she is dying, due to lack of oxygen.  Even though she isn't.  Her lungs are regenerating, but she is also losing oxygen at the same time.--{{User:Catalyst/sig}} 20:39, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*Remeber Adam, how Hiro stuck him in a coffin and buried him alive? Same thing, bigger coffin.--[[User:Dance4thedead|Dance4thedead]] 21:36, 9 February 2010 (EST)
*Scientifically, it sounds absurd. However, that seems to be how the power works on the show.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 22:07, 9 February 2010 (EST)
**What about when she was hiding underwater with Alex, then? --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 23:47, 9 February 2010 (EST)
***Wasn't she drowning until Alex "air-kissed" her? She certainly didn't look like she was okay.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 23:51, 9 February 2010 (EST)
****I think the point is she would die, until oxygen reached her lungs again, thus she'd regenerate eventually.  Still doesnt add up with the Meredith scene, that is pretty dumb.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 01:47, 10 February 2010 (EST)
*****Claire can suffocate, it's like with Adam. She die from lack of air, then her lungs would regenerate, then she'd die again, and so on, and so on until she could dig her way back out of the coffin. This is why she needed Alex to help her breathe underwater and why Meredith was able to choke her due to lack of oxygen. It's consistent with past events, if not particularly scientifically plausible. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 05:12, 10 February 2010 (EST)
******With the Alex thing it wasn't so she wouldn't die, it was because they didn't want the air from her lungs to cause bubbles, and them get found by the agents. With the whole Meredith bit, it wasn't so much to show that she could die, more for showing that she was still vunerable to pain, though not physical. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 11:55, 10 February 2010 (EST)
*By the way, what ''is'' the "bad words" policy?--[[User:Boycool42|Boycool42]] 17:22, 22 February 2010 (EST)
**We don't use them. We're a family friendly wiki. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 17:23, 22 February 2010 (EST)
***<small>Must we use that phrase...</small>--{{User:PJDEP/signature1}} 17:41, 22 February 2010 (EST)
****<small>You're right. We're a f***** f******* wiki.</small> :) --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 17:45, 22 February 2010 (EST)
** There's no official policy, but we've always followed the tone of the show. It's not always "family friendly", but it's not gutter street talk, either. There's a happy medium to find. Use the show as your guide for what's appropriate and what's not. And always err on the side of caution. :) -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 23:19, 22 February 2010 (EST)

==Is there going to be a Volume 6==

Just asking. Don't know where to ask this. And is there still going to be more Istories and GNs even after the show ends?--[[User:Realistic|Realistic]]

dunno about the GN's or the Istories but there will be a volume six coming out Fall of 2010. Greg Grunberg, who plays Matt Parkman on the show, said: "We wrapped yesterday and the [final episode] is nowhere near a series finale, It is cliffhanger-y and exciting, but it is nowhere near an end to a series that people are so invested in. It does not tie everything up in a neat bow… I don’t have any doubt that the show will be back." And if they were to end the series here, they would've said something about it saying "DON'T MISS HEROES' LAST EPISODE" or, something... [[User:Meteoritu|Meteoritu]], February 11th

== Intuitive aptitude ==

Did anyone else catch when Samuel said, "See you got my power", and Peter responded with, "Funny how that works" during their duel?  He most likely replicated terrakinesis, but an interesting line to be said, especially since we have heard that line before.  Sylar said that line at the end of [[Into Asylum]] I believe.--{{User:Catalyst/sig}} 16:54, 10 February 2010 (EST)
*What was happening at the time?--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 16:55, 10 February 2010 (EST)
Danko said 
"If we do this... if we succeed... you'll be the only one left. Sylar responded by saying "Funny how that works."

== Any thoughts on the 4 heroes season finales we've seen? ==

I really enjoyed this finale.  Of course there were things that I didn't like.  But overall it was a solid ending to a good season.  I think the season finales for heroes have all been pretty good.  I'm sure most would say that the 1st season's finale was the best.  But I thought 2 was good and 3 was ok (even though we weren't able to see the fight of the century).  I'd would like to hear some of your comments on this episode as a season finale in comparison to the other 3....--[[User:Z447|Z447]] 11:01, 11 February 2010 (EST)

* I think the first season finale was the best of them all, because the first season was the series' best season ever. The second one was actually good due to the situation of writers' strike, as it ended prematurely, because I would have loved to see the pandemic... The third one was good, even though I didn't like the season that much, so in comparison, this season finale was actually pretty damn good, given that this season Heroes went back to its roots and all, and it was very satisfying. Thing is, I don't see where they will go now... [[User:Meteoritu|Meteoritu]]
*1 & 3 went all out on the season finales.  For season 2, they turned Powerless into a finale at the last minute.  I really think they didn't have a big enough budget (or good enough writers) to make Brave New World as good.--[[User:Boycool42|Boycool42]] 20:26, 21 February 2010 (EST)

==Doyle vs. Sylar==
Was Sylar holding back against Doyle? Cause I'm pretty sure we confirmed it in S3 that Doyle wasn't strong enough to be able to control Sylar. --[[User:Formless|Formless]] 20:54, 10 February 2010 (EST)
*Possibly, Sylar's trying to be good and not harm people as much, and in Dual he did seem to seriously harm Doyle to overpower him. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 20:55, 10 February 2010 (EST)
**I think he was trying to negotiate with Doyle due to his reformation. I think Sylar was on the brink of incapacitating him, but Emma got to him first.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 20:56, 10 February 2010 (EST)
***If you pay attention to his hands, Doyle ''makes'' Sylar's hands point behind him that way he can't telekinetically push Doyle to the ground. Sylar couldn't do anything. {{User:Iheartheroes/sig}} 21:02, 10 February 2010 (EST)
****Sylar has shown that he can use TK while his hands were otherwise occupied. It's the power to move objects with the mind. He also could have using something like sound manipulation.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 21:04, 10 February 2010 (EST)
*****Doyle can also control the use of a special's powers though (in a GN he made a guy fire a laser at himself) so it may be that he's just learned a lesson here and shut off sylar's abilities.  --[[User:Action Figure|Action Figure]] 04:16, 11 February 2010 (EST)
******I agree with the above.  I think Sylar was holding back.  But also even in S3 Doyle was able to control Sylar for a little while until he weakened or got tired.  Then Sylar was able to take advantage of it.  So if Emma didn't attack Doyle, Sylar definitely would've overpowered him.--[[User:Z447|Z447]] 11:07, 11 February 2010 (EST)
******* Two things are at play--Sylar is trying to turn over a new leaf, and he also hasn't used his abilities (save but once) in the past nine years. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 12:30, 11 February 2010 (EST)

==Season five==
See [http://ausiellofiles.ew.com/2010/01/07/greg-grunbergs-heroes-will-be-back/ here].--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] - [[User Talk:PJDEP|Need further explanation?]] 00:04, 11 February 2010 (EST)
*Heroes may be back... but will Greg be? Interesting...--[[User:EvilMaldini|Evil Maldini]] 13:02, 16 February 2010 (EST)

== Is it me? ==
Is it me and does will sound stupid but, did Hiro gain some weight lately? seems hes a big 'heavier' then other times lol -- ([[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]]) 00:34, 11 February 2010 (EST)
* Matt too. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 12:30, 11 February 2010 (EST)
** Indeed, guess they enjoying their money from heroes :p -- ([[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]]) 22:25, 11 February 2010 (EST)

== Death Note reference ==

Don't get me wrong, I'm a Death Note freak, but I don't know if the reference in the last section of this episode's page is viable... I don't think it's that important to be there. --[[User:Meteoritu|Meteoritu]], February 11th
*Agreed.--[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 07:02, 11 February 2010 (EST)
** Agree. Similarities are not necessarily references. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 12:31, 11 February 2010 (EST)

== What I don't get ==
So an hour was like 1 year in Sylar/Peters mind, but when they came out peter says, around a half day. after matt asked he changed just in a couple of hours, peter said it was 5 years, seems that peter has small half days :p lol half day = around 12 hours , compared to 5 :p -- ([[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]]) 22:28, 11 February 2010 (EST)
* I don't think anybody was keeping exact track. Also, I know I've had dreams where it seems it took both days and seconds at the same time. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 22:48, 11 February 2010 (EST)
** Well a Day can also be the daylight proportion of a 24-hour day (as opposed to the Night), so that would be 12 hours and half that is 6 hours. So 5 hours is "about half a Day".--[[User:Thanatos|Thanatos]] 06:48, 12 February 2010 (EST)
*** A day is a day, day contains 24 hours :) -- ([[User:WaterRatj|WaterRatj]]) 09:13, 12 February 2010 (EST)
****Perhaps the nightmare isn't quite as "slowed down" when there are multiple people within.  The first 3 hours were 3 years when Sylar was alone.  Then the next 9 hours were 2 years when they were together. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 10:14, 12 February 2010 (EST)
*****Given that it was night when Peter went into Sylar's head, and morning when they came out, I'd say 6 hours is being counted as half a day. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 11:49, 12 February 2010 (EST)

== Noah/Claire/Lauren gets to NY ==

I can remember someone asking how these three got to NY so fast from Calafornia. Well, I think I know. The trailer gets sunk one day by Samuel, then the same day Lauren is walking above them. That night (because they wouldn't last a full day) Tracy rescues them, and they get a helicopter the same night. That's how they get cross country for the next night in New York. A valid theory? --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 08:00, 16 February 2010 (EST)
* California? They came from the carnival's usual unknown location. - [[User:Josh|Josh]] ([[User talk:Josh|talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Josh|contribs]]) 09:55, 16 February 2010 (EST)
**I'm sure it was somewhere near California. When Matt and Noah went after Vanessa and Samuel in the car, that's where they ended up. Sure it could've moved, but look at it this way, California is one of the furthest points away from NY, so if they were even closer, then it would be even more likely they'd make it in time. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 11:46, 16 February 2010 (EST)
***But see, you're assuming they were in the United States. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 11:58, 16 February 2010 (EST)
****Well, given that Noah and Lauren knew where it was because of the landslide which was in US, they got there. Then Noah was captured, Samuel sunk the trailer and Lauren returned to the exact same place, I think it's pretty safe to assume that they're in the US. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 12:03, 16 February 2010 (EST)
***They went after them in California, but they reached the carnival which teleported to the unknown location. - [[User:Josh|Josh]] ([[User talk:Josh|talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Josh|contribs]]) 19:00, 16 February 2010 (EST)
==Whats your Favorite==
I know we might see Heroes again i hope we do but anyway What is you're favorite episode ever in the whole Heroes Series and also put your favorite Character ever minor or major?--[[User:Skyeatsout|Skyeatsout]] 00:19, 20 February 2010 (EST)
* Favorite episode: dead tie between Shadowboxing and HTSAEM. (HTSAEM for the obvious reasons, and Shadowboxing because I'm a huge Pemma shipper)  Favorite character: DAPHNE!!!!!  BEST CHARACTER EVER!!!!  She comes in right before Peter, Emma, Molly, and Sylar.  In that order.  Period.  But seriously though- Daphne was the most emotionally complex, most interesting, most FUN character Heroes ever created... and she died as a PLOT DEVICE.  What was UP with that?  --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 23:13, 1 March 2010 (EST)
*Five Years Gone, amazingly badass. I liked Molly because it was interesting to see how a child handed abilities (Micah's too... Micah-ish, if you know what I mean). I'm also a big fan of René and really want to see more of him. I think him and Peter have a bit of a bromance going on....--{{User:PJDEP/signature1}} 23:17, 1 March 2010 (EST)
*Ooh, FYG, another great one.  But I think I'm still sticking with Shadowboxing and HTSAEM.  Though, perhaps I should tack Cold Snap onto that as well.  Even though that episode is tragic for what happened to poor Daphne, the whole BAMFish Tracy scene... wow.  Epic.  --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 23:20, 1 March 2010 (EST)
**Oh yes FYG im agreeing with that especially because of Sylar and Peter another epic fight, missed, but my Favourite character is Evil Sylar he is the best, not good Sylar we've been through this before "people don't change Elle" -Sylar --[[User:Melkor111|Melkor111]] 19:57, 6 March 2010 (EST)
**I like a lot of episodes, but my favorites are: [[Once Upon a Time in Texas]], [[I Am Become Death]] and [[Shades of Gray]]. But like I sad I like a lot of episodes. My favorite character ever is evil-Sylar. (&^%&^&* SAINT-SYLAR!) --{{User:Yoshi n1/sig1}} 13:43, 5 March 2010 (EST)
***I dunno, I'm actually kind of a fan of nu!Sylar.  The evil!Sylar storyline was getting overplayed and too repetitive for its own good.  I mean, don't get me wrong, there was a time (it ended right about midway through season 2) when there was no villain imaginable who was as slick and charismatic and just plain PSYCHO as Sylar.  But then Adam Monroe came on the scene, and the bar for evil was raised.  Quinto did a fantastic job... but there was just no competing with the incredibly fabulous Adam.  And when you look at evil!Sylar in contrast to Samuel, there's again no comparison, particularly because Sylar's storyline has been so tremendously confused and awkward this season.  It was time to make a change. --[[User:Clairesxtwin48|Clairesxtwin48]] 18:06, 5 March 2010 (EST)

==Mulligan==
We shouldn't add Mulligan in the characters appearances? Isn't he arrived by helicopter to take HRG and the others? --{{User:Tanderix/sign}} 20:33 (Italy) 21 February 2010
*Mulligan was with the Carnival when it went to NY. That's what iStory said. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 14:39, 21 February 2010 (EST)
**The iStory said that he and the watcher went with the carnival to New York, but they got a person with [[Enhanced teleporting]] to send them back in time to where the carnival was or something like that, then he calls in a favour from one of his old Primatech bosses who gets them the helicopter, and he flies it to Lauren and Noah and Claire and picks them up. Only question is... do we count him as appearing if his face can't be seen that clearly, or at all really? --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 14:58, 21 February 2010 (EST)
*** Mulligan was the guy riding the helicopter. And no, if we never saw him, we don't count him as having an episodic appearance. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 16:10, 21 February 2010 (EST)
**** Since, why we put "Mr. Linderma" in Genesis' character appearances? We don't see him in the episode. --[[User:Tanderix|Tanderix]] 10:33, 25 February 2010 (EST)
***** Linderman is not in the [[Template:AppearancesGenesis|character appearances for ''Genesis'']]. -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 21:07, 25 February 2010 (EST)
******Sorry, in the story development. --[[User:Tanderix|Tanderix]] 08:26, 26 February 2010 (EST)
*******That's in there because he's a part of the plot. He helps to develop the story. Hence the name of the section. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 13:27, 26 February 2010 (EST)

== Angela and Mohinder ==

The trivia section says this is the first season finale where one or more living main characters do not appear... Is this true? [[Maya]] never died, but wouldn't she still be considered a main character during volume 4? I know this sounds like a technicality, I'm just thinking out loud here... --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 17:10, 12 May 2010 (EDT)

== Peter and Noah ==

Those two had that "one of us, one of them" thing going on in Jump, Push, Fall and here they kinda ended what they started there.  I thought that was great.--[[User:WarGrowlmon18|WarGrowlmon18]] 23:54, 24 June 2010 (EDT)